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Lupus_aka_Den
27th October 2004, 13:21
The Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer is a DirectShow« filter that provides demultiplexing of MPEG-4 (Intermedia Format (MP4)), 3GPP2 System streams into a MPEG-4, H.263, AVC/H.264 video streams and AAC, AMR, MP3 audio streams.
Compatible with:
(Video)
- Moonlight MPEG4 Video Decoder (http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip Beta version)
- Moonlight H.264 Video Decoder (http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/h264/h264_dec_pack1_1_40916.zip or http://www.moonlightcordless.com/download/h264_dec_pack1_1_40916.zip)
- ffdshow MPEG-4 Video Decoder (for H.263)
- 3ivx D4 Video Decoder
Notes: Identify only I,P frames

(Audio)
- Moonlight Odio Dekoda (http://www.elecard.com/products/mpeg2decoder.shtml)
- Moonlight AMR Decoder
- dicas AMR Audio Decoder
- ffdshow Audio Decoder (for AAC and MP3)
- 3ivx D4 Audio Decoder
- CoreAAC Audio Decoder

Download from:
http://www.elecard.com/download/ or
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/misc/beta/MP4Demux.zip

Contact us at tsup@moonlight.com.ru with technical questions and bug reports

bond
27th October 2004, 18:52
wow cool stuff, another directshow .mp4 container splitter, able to even handle h.264-in-mp4 :)

Lupus_aka_Den, are you related somehow to moonlight/elecard?

did you try the coreaac aac audio decoder and the xvid, divx5 and ffdshow video decoders for mpeg-4/h.264 with this demuxer filter? did it work?

moved to container forum, as its more a container (.mp4) topic

gotaserena
27th October 2004, 18:58
reported fourCC for H.264 is "s264"?

bond
27th October 2004, 21:02
Originally posted by gotaserena
reported fourCC for H.264 is "s264"?indeed, evil moonlight. time to ask milan to add "s264" to the supported fourccs in ffdshow

but their splitter outputs "mp4v" for mpeg-4 part2 streams, which means it can be used with the xvid, 3ivx, ffdshow and divx5 decoder
it also supports coreaac

didnt try whether mp3-in-mp4 worked
edit: tried it and it seems that the moonlight splitter doesnt support mp3-in-mp4. it can connect to the filesource filter, but neither the default windows mp3 decoder, nor moonlight's own odio dekoda can connect to the splitter
(also it seems that mp4uis mp3 muxing outputs borken files, mp4creator works)

Lupus_aka_Den
28th October 2004, 07:50
Originally posted by bond
Lupus_aka_Den, are you related somehow to moonlight/elecard?

Yes, i'm Moonlight/Elecards software developer and author of MP4 Demultiplexer 8)
Originally posted by bond
did you try the coreaac aac audio decoder and the xvid, divx5 and ffdshow video decoders for mpeg-4/h.264 with this demuxer filter? did it work?

I try such graph (.mp4 with MPEG-4 and AAC):
------------------------------------------/->CoreAAC Audio Decoder->Render
FileSource(Async)->MP4 Demuxer->
------------------------------------------\->ffdshow MPEG4 Video Decoder->Render

This work, but i found some problems with navigation that I plan to fix in the future

H.264 properly working with our decoder, ffdshow video decoder can't connecting with video pin

Lupus_aka_Den
28th October 2004, 07:58
Originally posted by gotaserena
reported fourCC for H.264 is "s264"?
No, I choose "s264" because i can't find any information about fourCC code for H.264. "s264" simulate "s263" for H.263

Lupus_aka_Den
28th October 2004, 08:06
Originally posted by bond
indeed, evil moonlight
Thanks 8)
Originally posted by bond
time to ask milan to add "s264" to the supported fourccs in ffdshow

but their splitter outputs "mp4v" for mpeg-4 part2 streams, which means it can be used with the xvid, 3ivx, ffdshow and divx5 decoder
it also supports coreaac

didnt try whether mp3-in-mp4 worked
edit: tried it and it seems that the moonlight splitter doesnt support mp3-in-mp4. it can connect to the filesource filter, but neither the default windows mp3 decoder, nor moonlight's own odio dekoda can connect to the splitter
(also it seems that mp4uis mp3 muxing outputs borken files, mp4creator works)
I have no "mp3-in-mp4" streams. Could you give me url where i can found them?

Lupus_aka_Den
28th October 2004, 08:16
Originally posted by gotaserena in "muxing h.264 in mp4" thread
ffdshow-20041012 doesn't like avc1 in mp4 it seems. I just manage to open a h.264 encode done by mencoder in avi using graphedit, but if I mux the raw stream into mp4 using mp4creator I can't decode it anymore. Splitter was 3ivx's. I changed the fourcc from h264 to avc1 and ffdshow still played it .
VLC 0.8-2 opens the mp4 without any problems, though.

Interesting.. I'll try to change my "s264" on "avc1"

gotaserena
28th October 2004, 08:41
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Interesting.. I'll try to change my "s264" on "avc1"

Well, that's the official standard for h.264 in mp4! :)

But thanks a lot for implementing it!

Lupus_aka_Den
28th October 2004, 08:54
Originally posted by gotaserena
Well, that's the official standard for h.264 in mp4! :)


Really? Could you give me name or url on such document?

Originally posted by gotaserena
But thanks a lot for implementing it!
It's my job 8)

yaz
28th October 2004, 09:49
Originally posted by bond
indeed, evil moonlight. i don't think so :-) say, the mpeg2 support they released was far the best and the most stable. i've used that exclusively. now, ffdshow seems to be reached acceptable speed and stability.
as regards h264/mp4, it is the only solution at the moment.
Originally posted by bond
time to ask milan to add "s264" to the supported fourccs in ffdshow no, it's time to ask lupus very kindly to keep up with the standards, say, outputting 'avc1' or 'h264'.

i tried the stuff this way
- elecard demux registered
- x264 encoded into avi by mencoder
- the video (re)wrapped into mp4 by mp4creator (thx, gotaserena)
- 's264' registered and related to vss decoder (sorry, lupus, i plan to try elecard decoder too, but no time so far :-))
- mpc plays it fine (if inner mp4 support is switched off)

i haven't tried adding aac but it'll the next

thx for releasing this stuff ... btw ... moonlight a/o elecard ? ... i'm always confused :-)

thx
y

bond
28th October 2004, 19:39
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Yes, i'm Moonlight/Elecards software developer and author of MP4 Demultiplexernice, welcome to doom9 :)

Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Interesting.. I'll try to change my "s264" on "avc1"might be better. as i am sure you know mpeg-4 part2 video streams are marked as "mp4v" in .mp4, aac streams as "mp4a". in the same way avc streams are marked as "avc1", it could be therefore considered as something like the "official fourcc" i think :)

Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
I have no "mp3-in-mp4" streams. Could you give me url where i can found them?i dunno an url to one, but you can very easily create them yourself with the mp4creator tool of mpeg4ip, which you can find here (http://sourceforge.net/projects/mpeg4ip/)

its opensource and you will have to compile it yourself or you search around in this forum for some links to compiles

you can use the following commmandline for muxing .mp3 (or even .mp2) audio streams into .mp4:
mp4creator60.exe -c input.mp3 output.mp4btw the same way its also possible to store mpeg-1/2 video streams in .mp4 already, which you might want to support too!

Originally posted by yaz
it's time to ask lupus very kindly to keep up with the standards, say, outputting 'avc1' or 'h264'."h264" is nowhere mentioned in mpeg-4

mpc plays it fine (if inner mp4 support is switched off)mpc has internal .mp4 support?

gotaserena
28th October 2004, 19:51
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Really? Could you give me name or url on such document?

I believe it's in here (http://www.chiariglione.org/mpeg/working_documents/mpeg-04/avc_ff/avc_ff.zip) somewhere. Section 5.8.1 says that 'avc1', 'avcC' and 'm4ds' are acceptable "Box Types"

At any rate the page with all the info is here: http://www.chiariglione.org/mpeg/working_documents.htm

Looking forward to the new beta! :)

SeeMoreDigital
28th October 2004, 20:03
I've been looking for something like this but I can't make it work at all.

Please confirm, apart from this de-multiplexer, what other filters do you guys recommend installing?


Cheers

bond
28th October 2004, 20:16
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Please confirm, apart from this de-multiplexer, what other filters do you guys recommend installing?there is also a decoder package available on the same site, which includes moonlights h.264 decoder, which can connect to their .mp4 splitter

SeeMoreDigital
28th October 2004, 20:39
Looking at the information that comes (in the form of an PDF file) with the de-multiplexer, an mmpeg4dec.ax is available somewhere: -

http://img18.exs.cx/img18/4672/SMD_Moonlight_Mpeg4_DSdec_filter.gif

Is it within the "Moonlight H.264 Decoder&Streaming Pack 1.1.40916.exe" you mentioned?


Cheers

gotaserena
28th October 2004, 21:24
No, but the package comes with a "h264dec.ax" which does what it should, but with a logo! :)

Also, I couldn't make the demuxer work with 5.1 AAC.

SeeMoreDigital
28th October 2004, 21:44
Originally posted by gotaserena
No, but the package comes with a "h264dec.ax" which does what it should, but with a logo! :)

Also, I couldn't make the demuxer work with 5.1 AAC. Well this begs the question, where is the mmpeg4dec.ax DSdec filter?

But anyway, surely the MP4Demux.ax filter should be able to connect to other "non" Moonlight (Elecard) audio and video DSdec filters?


Cheers

timeismoney
29th October 2004, 02:31
A famous mp4 clip called SWAT_NeroSP2pass_AAC5.1.mp4 won't be played

info:

Stream 0

Media Type 0:
--------------------------
AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Stream {E436EB83-524F-11CE-9F53-0020AF0BA770}
subtype: MEDIASUBTYPE_QTMovie {E436EB89-524F-11CE-9F53-0020AF0BA770}
formattype: TIME_FORMAT_NONE {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 0


Media Type 1:
--------------------------
AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Stream {E436EB83-524F-11CE-9F53-0020AF0BA770}
subtype: TIME_FORMAT_NONE {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
formattype: TIME_FORMAT_NONE {00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 0

But great work, cheers!

Lupus_aka_Den
29th October 2004, 08:58
Originally posted by gotaserena
I believe it's in here (http://www.chiariglione.org/mpeg/working_documents/mpeg-04/avc_ff/avc_ff.zip) somewhere. Section 5.8.1 says that 'avc1', 'avcC' and 'm4ds' are acceptable "Box Types"

At any rate the page with all the info is here: http://www.chiariglione.org/mpeg/working_documents.htm

Thanks 8)
Originally posted by gotaserena
Looking forward to the new beta! :) [/B]
I'll try be quick 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
29th October 2004, 09:05
Originally posted by bond
btw the same way its also possible to store mpeg-1/2 video streams in .mp4 already, which you might want to support too!

I think about it 8) IMHO it's good idea
Thanks for help about mp3-in-mp4 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
29th October 2004, 09:21
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
But anyway, surely the MP4Demux.ax filter should be able to connect to other "non" Moonlight (Elecard) audio and video DSdec filters?
Cheers
Yes.
- ffdshow MPEG-4 Video Decoder (for MPEG-4, H.263)
- 3ivx D4 Video Decoder

- dicas AMR Audio Decoder
- ffdshow Audio Decoder
- 3ivx D4 Audio Decoder
- CoreAAC Audio Decoder

But sometimes problems occured with seeking 8(

Lupus_aka_Den
29th October 2004, 09:37
Originally posted by timeismoney
A famous mp4 clip called SWAT_NeroSP2pass_AAC5.1.mp4 won't be played
Where i can found this clip ?
Originally posted by timeismoney

But great work, cheers!
Thanks 8)

ac-chan123
29th October 2004, 13:46
@bond: follow mp4creator the MPEG-A standard or the MPEG 4, for mp3 inside mp4?

SeeMoreDigital
29th October 2004, 19:13
You can use mp4UI to mux mp3 audio only streams into MP4.... Finding media players that can play 'em, is another matter - So far it's RealPlayer only for me.

I've created some short examples of an Mpeg4+Mp3+subs in MP4 and an Mp3 in MP4, here (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/seemoredigital/XviD+Mp3+Subs.zip).


Cheers

pogo stick
30th October 2004, 01:04
This may be interesting for many people here: Lupus mentioned that MP4 muxer is in plans. In near or not near future.
I think, it would be great! :)

By the way, if someone understands Russian better then English here (http://forum.mediatory.ru/topic2828.phtml) is thread by Lupus about Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer in Russian forum.

timeismoney
30th October 2004, 03:35
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Where i can found this clip ?

I looked for it on internet but no result, so I uploaded it here:

Download here (http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/SWAT_Nero_SP_2pass_AAC+SBR(5.1).mp4)

It can be splitted by 3ivx media splitter, but failed when use moonlight demuxer

Lupus_aka_Den
31st October 2004, 10:46
Originally posted by pogo stick
This may be interesting for many people here: Lupus mentioned that MP4 muxer is in plans. In near or not near future.
I think, it would be great! :)
We are going to release it at nearest future.
Originally posted by pogo stick
By the way, if someone understands Russian better then English here (http://forum.mediatory.ru/topic2828.phtml) is thread by Lupus about Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer in Russian forum.
Thanks 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
31st October 2004, 10:56
Originally posted by timeismoney
I looked for it on internet but no result, so I uploaded it here:

Download here (http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/SWAT_Nero_SP_2pass_AAC+SBR(5.1).mp4)

It can be splitted by 3ivx media splitter, but failed when use moonlight demuxer
Thank you. I'll try to check it

pogo stick
31st October 2004, 16:29
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Looking at the information that comes (in the form of an PDF file) with the de-multiplexer, an mmpeg4dec.ax is available somewhere
It's in Moonlight-Elecard MPEG2 Video Decoder v. 2.0 build 3611 as well as H.264 decoder.
Here: http://www.elecard.com/download/#mpeg2decoder
It has deinterlacing support! But I didn't have a time to try it yet. I hope it's good!

pogo stick
31st October 2004, 20:09
I have some bad and good news.
New ffdshow build's encoder and decoder (compiled by Celtic Druid) are not configuratable, but I installed previous version and replaced files with new ones. It works and, by the way, Snow is in. :)
Now ffdshow is able to connect to both Moonlight demultiplexer and new Nero parser (this one surprised me a lot!).
With Moonlight demultiplexer video is buggy, but not in the same way as with Moonlight H.264 decoder. So something is wrong with demultiplexer or decoders. Lupus, take a look at the second page of muxing h.264 in mp4 (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=84456&perpage=20&pagenumber=2) thread. I posted sample there.
Video is not decodable with Nero parser, only sound. Also interesting thing about Nero stuff:

http://pogo-stick.nm.ru/nero subs.jpg

This is graph with MPC playback. See SubPicture out and in, but Subs are not shown. Strange.
More good news about Moonlight MPEG-4 decoder. It's not only have deinterlacing and postprocessing support, but also auto-resizing! :)
And bad news: it's seems buggy with XviD ASP@L5 (without QPel) encodes and interlaced ones look awful. :( SP test encodes seems to be OK though.
Moonlight demultiplexer don't work for almost all of my XviD encodes, so I tested decoder with 3ivx splitter. Looking forward to more working beta.

Lupus_aka_Den
1st November 2004, 09:49
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Thank you. I'll try to check it
It was a bag. Fixed. Download an updated version of demixer from old link 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
1st November 2004, 10:09
Originally posted by pogo stick
Now ffdshow is able to connect to both Moonlight demultiplexer and new Nero parser (this one surprised me a lot!).
I can't repeat this with latest version of ffdshow 20041012 8(
Originally posted by pogo stick
Lupus, take a look at the second page of muxing h.264 in mp4 (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=84456&perpage=20&pagenumber=2) thread. I posted sample there.

Thanks 8)
Originally posted by pogo stick
And bad news: it's seems buggy with XviD ASP@L5 (without QPel) encodes and interlaced ones look awful. :( SP test encodes seems to be OK though.
Moonlight demultiplexer don't work for almost all of my XviD encodes, so I tested decoder with 3ivx splitter.
Could you give me such stream ? XviD encodes or decoders? Which decoders are you used?
Originally posted by pogo stick
Looking forward to more working beta.
I hope it happened at nearest future 8)

bond
1st November 2004, 21:51
Originally posted by ac-chan123
@bond: follow mp4creator the MPEG-A standard or the MPEG 4, for mp3 inside mp4?hm, whats the difference between these two? as mpeg-a was never mentioned by anyone i talked to about it (eg mpeg4ip and 3ivx guys), i assume its the mpeg-4 way

SeeMoreDigital
1st November 2004, 23:41
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
You can use mp4UI to mux mp3 audio only streams into MP4.... Finding media players that can play 'em, is another matter - So far it's RealPlayer only for me. Thankfully Nero's new release of NeroVision Express 3, complete with Recode2 and ShowTime Player, now plays mp3 in MP4...


Cheers

timeismoney
2nd November 2004, 03:21
Thanks Lupus_aka_Den

The new one works with aac 5.1, great work and surprised efficiency.

Now I found when seeking it will last 1 or 2 secs's frames broken like this:

http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/df00008_2.JPG

Then everything is OK, maybe not bug but wish to improve it, thanks.

And here is a "addon" question: which directshow filter can play amr audio, except nero's...

pogo stick
2nd November 2004, 05:33
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
I can't repeat this with latest version of ffdshow 20041012 8(
As reported Demultiplexer can not connect to ffdshow 20041012 because of s264. But Celtic Druid added s264 to his build of ffdshow. You can get it here (http://celticdruid.no-ip.com/xvid/Misc/). Things would be much easier if you would change it to avc1.
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Could you give me such stream ? XviD encodes or decoders? Which decoders are you used?
I tested Moonlight MPEG-4 decoder with my XviD ASP@L5 (without QPel) encodes and 3ivx splitter because I couldn't open most of my mp4 files with your Demultiplexer.
I can not provide streams right now. I will try later. But for more testing you can easily make it yourself with XviD and mp4box.

timeismoney
2nd November 2004, 07:59
pogo stick, I downloaded and tried your avc1 mp4 from here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=84456&perpage=20&pagenumber=2), using MPC

Use 3ivx there is no video but switch the 2 audio channels successfully

Use moonlight show error message, because of s264 and avc1's support

So I made a little modify that change moonlight's s264 to avc1, it appears correct video but when seeking or switching between 2 audio channels, MPC crashed...

I have no other mp4 clips with multi audio channels, so Lupus_aka_Den, is it a bug? please check it if you don't mind, and I think to support avc1 will be more compatible

Thank you.

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 09:06
Originally posted by timeismoney
Thanks Lupus_aka_Den
The new one works with aac 5.1, great work and surprised efficiency.
You are welcome 8)
Originally posted by timeismoney
Now I found when seeking it will last 1 or 2 secs's frames broken Then everything is OK, maybe not bug but wish to improve it, thanks.

I'll check it...
Originally posted by timeismoney
And here is a "addon" question: which directshow filter can play amr audio, except nero's...
dicas AMR Audio Decoder (mpegable) and our Moonlight AMR Decoder (AMR NB, early beta version, available soon for downloading)

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 11:09
Originally posted by pogo stick
As reported Demultiplexer can not connect to ffdshow 20041012 because of s264. But Celtic Druid added s264 to his build of ffdshow. Things would be much easier if you would change it to avc1.

Now Moonlight MP4Demuxer use "avc1" instead "s264" for H.264 8))
Originally posted by pogo stick
I tested Moonlight MPEG-4 decoder with my XviD ASP@L5 (without QPel) encodes and 3ivx splitter because I couldn't open most of my mp4 files with your Demultiplexer.
I can not provide streams right now. I will try later. But for more testing you can easily make it yourself with XviD and mp4box.
Interesting.. I'll try make large stream with mp4box

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 11:37
Originally posted by timeismoney
pogo stick, I downloaded and tried your avc1 mp4 from here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=84456&perpage=20&pagenumber=2), using MPC
Use moonlight show error message

You should try our H.264 Decoder, but picture crashed sometimes.
Originally posted by timeismoney
... because of s264 and avc1's support

Fixed 8)
Originally posted by timeismoney
So I made a little modify that change moonlight's s264 to avc1, it appears correct video but when seeking or switching between 2 audio channels, MPC crashed...
I have no other mp4 clips with multi audio channels, so Lupus_aka_Den, is it a bug? please check it if you don't mind
Thank you.
I tried render Kiki.mp4 in graphedit. Working without graphedit crash
Two Odio-Dekodas, our H.264 decoder...

timeismoney
2nd November 2004, 11:51
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
our Moonlight AMR Decoder (AMR NB, early beta version, available soon for downloading)

Glad to hear that and wish to be release soon... :p

Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
I try render Kiki.mp4 in graphedit. Working without graphedit crash
Two Odio-Decodas, our H.264 decoder...

That test I use ffdshow as video decoder and coreaac as audio decoder

last test I use ffdshow as audio decoder, switch audio channels won't crash but seek still cause crash

I'd try moonlight Odio-Decodas and H.264 decoder for next test soon, thank you.

SeeMoreDigital
2nd November 2004, 12:04
Okay... What's the bottom line with this de-multiplexer... Is it worth the effort... yet?

I've tried it with Moonlight's Mpeg4 and h.264 filters and I'm sorry to say I wasn't that impressed... Apart from the annoying "logos", both seemed rather sluggish. And neither appeared to detect PAR signalling!


Cheers

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 12:15
I send a letter to Milan about some specific information for decoder (decoder info and sample organization). I'll find out what should be transmitted to ffdshow decoder so that it operates correctly with my demuxer. As soon as it is implemented the new version will be released.

timeismoney
2nd November 2004, 12:30
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
I send a letter to Milan about some specific information for decoder (decoder info and sample organization). I'll find out what should be transmitted to ffdshow decoder so that it operates correctly with my demuxer. As soon as it is implemented the new version will be released.

Maybe it's the keystone.

I tried Odio Dekoda and moonlight h264 decoder, well there is no crash

Then I use moonlight h264 video decoder + ffdshow or coreaac, there is no crash, either

The last test is use ffdshow as video decoder, well, both Odio Dekoda and other decoder - I mean the seeking or switching crash appear again.

So maybe it is because of ffdshow video deocder Vs. moonlight mp4 demuxer. They're not very friendly. Keep in touch with milan will help, hehe...

Thank you.

By the way, use Odio Dekoda as audio decoder, the beginning 2 or 3 sec will have a short discordant sound, then Ok.

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 12:38
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Okay... What's the bottom line with this de-multiplexer... Is it worth the effort... yet?

I think it is too early to draw an ultimate conclusion about the demuxer, as it is the beta version only. 8)
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I've tried it with Moonlight's Mpeg4 and h.264 filters and I'm sorry to say I wasn't that impressed... Apart from the annoying "logos"
Both decoders are evualation versions

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 12:54
Originally posted by timeismoney
I tried Odio Dekoda and moonlight h264 decoder, well there is no crash
Then I use moonlight h264 video decoder + ffdshow or coreaac, there is no crash, either
It's good 8)
Originally posted by timeismoney
The last test is use ffdshow as video decoder, well, both Odio Dekoda and other decoder - I mean the seeking or switching crash appear again. So maybe it is because of ffdshow video deocder Vs. moonlight mp4 demuxer. They're not very friendly.
Exactly 8) I'll try to fixed it
Originally posted by timeismoney
By the way, use Odio Dekoda as audio decoder, the beginning 2 or 3 sec will have a short discordant sound, then Ok.
Thanks 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
2nd November 2004, 16:39
Insert: support mp3-on-mp4 8)
Fixed: bag with large streams
Download an updated version of demixer from old link http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/misc/beta/MP4Demux.zip

ac-chan123
2nd November 2004, 17:10
On wich Standard base your MP3 in .mp4 implementation? Is it MPEG4(ISO/IEC 14496) or MPEG-A?

timeismoney
2nd November 2004, 17:14
I'm sorry but new version won't work with aac in mp4, both coreaac & ffdshow

Stream 0
Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer

Media Type 0:
--------------------------
AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: Unknown GUID Name {99C00BDC-3BF1-4889-9873-F1178D3C5679}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 23

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0000
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 16000
nAvgBytesPerSec: 0
nBlockAlign: 0
wBitsPerSample: 0
cbSize: 5 (extra bytes)


Media Type 1:
--------------------------
AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: Unknown GUID Name {CA9A0EDC-38B0-4FA6-B34A-3019543A0C57}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 23

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0000
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 16000
nAvgBytesPerSec: 0
nBlockAlign: 0
wBitsPerSample: 0
cbSize: 5 (extra bytes)


Media Type 2:
--------------------------
AM_MEDIA_TYPE:
majortype: MEDIATYPE_Audio {73647561-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
subtype: Unknown GUID Name {000000FE-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71}
formattype: FORMAT_WaveFormatEx {05589F81-C356-11CE-BF01-00AA0055595A}
bFixedSizeSamples: 1
bTemporalCompression: 0
lSampleSize: 1
cbFormat: 23

WAVEFORMATEX:
wFormatTag: 0x0000
nChannels: 2
nSamplesPerSec: 16000
nAvgBytesPerSec: 0
nBlockAlign: 0
wBitsPerSample: 0
cbSize: 5 (extra bytes)

This file played well with a previous version, that h264 with 2 audio channels file

And I test some other mp4, too, same result, I think there is something have mistake

PS: I unreg the previous version at first

gotaserena
2nd November 2004, 21:40
I've managed to play aac, funnily. There's no support for 5.1. Codec of H.264 is changed to avc1 (thanks Lupus!) but seeking doesn't work.

celtic_druid
2nd November 2004, 22:09
Coreaac reports 6 channels here for me and seeking seems to work fine. That is with the previous splitter though and ffdshow modified to handle s264.

With the current version audio is the same as reported by timeismoney, however on mine if registered Nero's audio decoder loads and then crashes. I haven't gotten around to installing Nero 6.6.0.1 yet though, perhaps that would help?

gotaserena
2nd November 2004, 22:45
I just tried again and you are right, celtic_druid. Audio is 6 channels in CoreAAC. I guess I was confused by the fact that the MP4demux claims that the audio is "48000KHz16bitStereo".

And that's with version 1.0.3

EDIT: Another stream I just tried crashed when connecting to CoreAAC. I found out that the demuxer is reporting 3 different audio streams:
Major Type: Audio - Sub Type: {99C00BDC-3BF1-4889-9873-F1178D3C5679} - Format: WaveFormatEx: 48.000 KHz 16 bit stereo
Major Type: Audio - Sub Type: {CA9A0EDC-38B0-4FA6-B34A-3019543A0C57} - Format: WaveFormatEx: 48.000 KHz 16 bit stereo
Major Type: Audio - Sub Type: {000000FE-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71} - Format: WaveFormatEx: 48.000 KHz 16 bit stereo
Which may be the cause for the crash. To add to the confusion, I tried another file with the same audio stream and got the right result:
Major Type: Audio - Sub Type: {000000FF-0000-0010-8000-00AA00389B71} - Format: WaveFormatEx: 48.000 KHz 16 bit stereo
The first file had xvid video, whereas the second had x264.

I think that the problem may be in the descriptors and BIFS tracks in the mp4 file. The first file was muxed with MP4Box (and thus isma compliant), whereas the second was muxed with mp4creator, which does not yet have isma compliancy implemented for H.264. Maybe the demuxer is passing all non-video tracks as audio?

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 05:12
Originally posted by ac-chan123
On wich Standard base your MP3 in .mp4 implementation? Is it MPEG4(ISO/IEC 14496) or MPEG-A?
I used http://gpac.sourceforge.net/tutorial/mediatypes.htm and http://www.itscj.ipsj.or.jp/sc29/open/29view/29n5556t.doc.

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 05:22
Originally posted by timeismoney
I'm sorry but new version won't work with aac in mp4, both coreaac & ffdshow
This file played well with a previous version, that h264 with 2 audio channels file
And I test some other mp4, too, same result, I think there is something have mistake
It was a bag 8( I used objectTypeIndication
from http://gpac.sourceforge.net/tutorial/mediatypes.htm for AAC and MP3 identify. But in my streams, objectTypeIndication for AAC equal 0x64. Fixed. You can download un updated version. Thanks for bag 8)
Originally posted by timeismoney
PS: I unreg the previous version at first
It's not necessarily 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 05:26
Originally posted by gotaserena
Codec of H.264 is changed to avc1 (thanks Lupus!) but seeking doesn't work.
ffdshow Video Decoder and Moonlight Mp4 Demuxer are not very friendly for the time being

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 06:01
Originally posted by gotaserena
I just tried again and you are right, celtic_druid. Audio is 6 channels in CoreAAC. I guess I was confused by the fact that the MP4demux claims that the audio is "48000KHz16bitStereo".

48.000 KHz 16 bit Stereo - this information contain in SampleDescriptionBox
Originally posted by gotaserena
Maybe the demuxer is passing all non-video tracks as audio?
Demuxer detect all non-video/audio stream, but all data for this track skipped (temporarily)

celtic_druid
3rd November 2004, 06:06
New version working fine here. Seeking with ffdshow works, just not as well as with avi's.

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 06:19
Originally posted by celtic_druid
New version working fine here. Seeking with ffdshow works, just not as well as with avi's.
Which version of ffdshow do you have? ffdshow-20041026 ?

timeismoney
3rd November 2004, 06:26
Originally posted by celtic_druid
New version working fine here. Seeking with ffdshow works, just not as well as with avi's.

Yes, new version seeking with ffdshow for common mp4 works fine, but for h264 is not very stable, seeking or switching audio channel still easy to cause mpc crash - when disable video it never crash.

Wish Lupus and milan's communion will have some help for this small problem.

No matter at all, it's good work and worth expecting...:p

PS: I use ffdshow 20041012, celtic_druid's webpage I can hardly visit...:scared:

celtic_druid
3rd November 2004, 06:36
That is why I also upped it here: http://s14.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=9264A2A007E28EAA667A98AA5BE442C8

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 07:00
Originally posted by celtic_druid
That is why I also upped it here: http://s14.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=9264A2A007E28EAA667A98AA5BE442C8
Thanks 8)

timeismoney
3rd November 2004, 07:06
Originally posted by celtic_druid
That is why I also upped it here: http://s14.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=9264A2A007E28EAA667A98AA5BE442C8 Thanks, and for your unupxed mpc.:)

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 13:14
Originally posted by timeismoney

Now I found when seeking it will last 1 or 2 secs's frames broken like this:

http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/df00008_2.JPG

Then everything is OK, maybe not bug but wish to improve it, thanks.

Which decoder do you use for this stream? ffdshow or our ? I'll try to make it fully compatible with the ffdshow decoder for MPEG-4 and H.264.

timeismoney
3rd November 2004, 13:50
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Which decoder do you use for this stream? ffdshow or our ? I'll try to make it fully compatible with the ffdshow decoder for MPEG-4 and H.264.

ffdshow 20041012 by milan cutka

use moonlight decoder is almost the same, or slightly better

Thank you.

ac-chan123
3rd November 2004, 14:33
@Lupus_aka_Den:

Can you extend your demultiplexor to support MPEG-A(http://www.itscj.ipsj.or.jp/sc29/open/29view/29n6302t.doc)?
This is an .mp4 Container with Mpeg 1/2 Layer 3, JPEG/JEPG200 und meta data as MPEG 7.

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 14:39
Originally posted by timeismoney
use moonlight decoder is almost the same, or slightly better
Thank you.
This is not actual build of the decoder. Tomorrow it will be updated. 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
3rd November 2004, 14:56
Originally posted by ac-chan123
@Lupus_aka_Den:
Can you extend your demultiplexor to support MPEG-A(http://www.itscj.ipsj.or.jp/sc29/open/29view/29n6302t.doc)?
This is an .mp4 Container with Mpeg 1/2 Layer 3, JPEG/JEPG200 und meta data as MPEG 7.
Mpeg 1/2 Layer 3 is supported. If you give me streams with "JPEG/JEPG200 und meta data as MPEG 7" i'll try to extend demuxer 8)

pogo stick
4th November 2004, 01:34
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Now Moonlight MP4Demuxer use "avc1" instead "s264" for H.264 8))
...
Insert: support mp3-on-mp4 8)
Fixed: bag with large streams
Great! Moonlight becomes a little less evil. :D
Originally posted by timeismoney
Use 3ivx there is no video but switch the 2 audio channels successfully
3ivx splitter can not work with H.264 video.
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Okay... What's the bottom line with this de-multiplexer... Is it worth the effort... yet?
I really hope it will. For me it's really important to have an alternative to Nero for playback of H.264 video in DS. Nero stuff have very annoying limitations.
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I've tried it with Moonlight's Mpeg4 and h.264 filters and I'm sorry to say I wasn't that impressed... Apart from the annoying "logos", both seemed rather sluggish. And neither appeared to detect PAR signalling!
Moonlight MPEG4 decoder have deinterlacing support which is very good, I think. And it detects PAR signaling for me.
But still too buggy to use with XviD encodes. I am looking forward to test a new version.

I tested new Demultiplexer version with some more MPEG4(XviD)+AAC in mp4 and ffdshow.
Demultiplexer work good with anamorphic and interlaced XviD video.
Files created with some old versions of mp4box are deadly freezing at the beginning of playback with your Demultiplexer, but it's OK with 3ivx and Nero.
mp4 with mp3 is trying to connect with Nero Audio Decoder and crash. Only if I disable it or force another mp3 decoder it works OK.
Those mp4 that was created with new mp4box and 3ivx are playable but with some problems: While seeking video looks awful until next I-Frame, sometimes crashing player.
Sometimes audio stops while video is playing and one time player just crashed on playback.
At some places video gets slow and jerky, skipping frames and sound. Always at the same places.
I can not provide any samples because they are too big and small ones are seems OK.

Lupus_aka_Den
4th November 2004, 06:58
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
This is not actual build of the decoder. Tomorrow it will be updated. 8)
You can download new beta version of Moonlight MPEG-4 Video Decoder from
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip

timeismoney
4th November 2004, 07:03
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
You can download new beta version of Moonlight MPEG-4 Video Decoder from
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip.

A more dot in the url :rolleyes:

should be http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip :p

Lupus_aka_Den
4th November 2004, 07:10
Originally posted by pogo stick
Great! Moonlight becomes a little less evil. :D

Thanks 8)
Originally posted by pogo stick
I tested new Demultiplexer version with some more MPEG4(XviD)+AAC in mp4 and ffdshow.
Moonlight Mp4 Demuxer and ffdshow Video Decoder are not very friendly (temporarily) 8)
Could you try our MPEG-4 decoder for your streams ?

Lupus_aka_Den
4th November 2004, 07:14
Originally posted by timeismoney
A more dot in the url :rolleyes:
should be http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip :p
Thanks 8) url must be without symbol '.'

Lupus_aka_Den
4th November 2004, 07:21
Since today you can ask your questions regarding Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer and other Moonlight-Elecard products on our forum: http://www.moonlight.co.il/forum/index.php

SeeMoreDigital
4th November 2004, 12:52
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Since today you can ask your questions regarding Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer and other Moonlight-Elecard products on our forum: http://www.moonlight.co.il/forum/index.php Thanks for posting the link...

When it comes to how Moonlights filters interact with other manufacturers filters, I think the bulk of us would prefer to discuss here. Otherwise people might miss some vital information!

For instance, Moonlight's Mpeg4 DSdec filter works with their DeMultiplexer, but it does not include any PAR signalling detection... So with this in mind, has anybody here managed get XviD's DSdecoder filter to work with their DeMultiplexer?


Cheers

ac-chan123
4th November 2004, 16:04
Sorry i have no MPEG-A file. This was only a question wich standard it is uesed and if MPEG-A will be possible.

pogo stick
4th November 2004, 16:13
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
You can download new beta version of Moonlight MPEG-4 Video Decoder from
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg/decoder/mpeg4dec.zip
It says:
"Internal Server Error
The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request.
Please contact the server administrator, webmaster@elecard.com and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error.
More information about this error may be available in the server error log."
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Moonlight Mp4 Demuxer and ffdshow Video Decoder are not very friendly (temporarily) 8)
It's pretty much the same with XviD decoder.
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
For instance, Moonlight's Mpeg4 DSdec filter works with their DeMultiplexer, but it does not include any PAR signalling detection...
You are right. Moonlight MPEG4 decoder auto-resize all anamorphic XviD encodes to AR 4:3 no matter what PAR is (even if pixels are square). I didn't notice it before because almost all of my encodes should look 4:3.
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
So with this in mind, has anybody here managed get XviD's DSdecoder filter to work with their DeMultiplexer?
XviD decoder works with Demultiplexer, but, as you know, it's buggy with PAR detection in mp4 or avi with unpacked bitstream.

SeeMoreDigital
4th November 2004, 17:27
Originally posted by pogo stick
...XviD decoder works with Demultiplexer, but, as you know, it's buggy with PAR detection in mp4 or avi with unpacked bitstream. Thanks for confirming this...

So if one does not wish to install say, Nero's NVE/Recode2 package or 3ivx's filter suite. Running the Moonlight DeMultiplexer, with XviD's video DSdec and Core's AAC audio DSdec, would appear to be one of the better set up options.


Cheers

Lupus_aka_Den
5th November 2004, 13:49
Originally posted by pogo stick
It says:
"Internal Server Error
The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request.
Please contact the server administrator, webmaster@elecard.com and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error.
More information about this error may be available in the server error log."

Fixed 8) You can download decoder from old link 8)
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg...er/mpeg4dec.zip

Lupus_aka_Den
5th November 2004, 15:06
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
For instance, Moonlight's Mpeg4 DSdec filter works with their DeMultiplexer, but it does not include any PAR signalling detection...
Could you give me such stream (with PAR signals) ?

SeeMoreDigital
5th November 2004, 15:21
Here's a short example of an Mpeg4+Mp3 in MP4 (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/seemoredigital/XviD+Mp3+Subs.zip)file, with PAR signalling.


Cheers

timeismoney
6th November 2004, 03:18
MPEG-4 AAC Main ADIF, 252 sec, 128 kbps, 44100 Hz

Here is a music_only .mp4 file (http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/card.mp4), please check it. It can be played by WinAMP via AudioCoding.com MPEG-4 General Audio player 2.1 beta, but can't be played by both moonlight MP4 Demultiplxer & 3ivx

SeeMoreDigital
6th November 2004, 11:13
Originally posted by timeismoney
MPEG-4 AAC Main ADIF, 252 sec, 128 kbps, 44100 Hz Not even mp4UI, Nero's ShowTime player or VLC will open it!

Looks like either the audio stream is not correct or it's not been muxed properly.


Cheers

Lupus_aka_Den
6th November 2004, 13:15
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Here's a short example of an Mpeg4+Mp3 in MP4 (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/seemoredigital/XviD+Mp3+Subs.zip)file, with PAR signalling.
Cheers
Thanks 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
6th November 2004, 17:08
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Looks like either the audio stream is not correct or it's not been muxed properly.
Cheers
It's not MPEG-4 Intermedia format (MP4). This stream do not have "mdat" and "moov" atoms 8)

pogo stick
6th November 2004, 22:03
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Fixed 8) You can download decoder from old link 8)
http://www.elecard.com/ftp/pub/mpeg...er/mpeg4dec.zip
Thanks.
Decoder seems to be good with seeking, though it skips more frames then it shows on playback. But the rest of what I was saying seems to be Demultiplexer's problem.

Lupus_aka_Den
7th November 2004, 15:11
Fixed some evil bags 8) You can download new version from old link 8)
Nero H.264 decoder support coming very soon 8)

timeismoney
8th November 2004, 08:43
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Fixed some evil bags 8) You can download new version from old link 8)
Nero H.264 decoder support coming very soon 8) :scared: :scared: Still not friendly to ffdshow h264, and no effects of PAR signalling in xvid video mp4

Lupus_aka_Den
8th November 2004, 08:54
Originally posted by timeismoney
:scared: :scared: Still not friendly to ffdshow h264, and no effects of PAR signalling in xvid video mp4
Yes, but i'll try be quick 8)

bond
8th November 2004, 21:36
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Looks like either the audio stream is not correct or it's not been muxed properly.might be, normally there cant be adif headers inside .mp4

timeismoney, how did you create that file?

timeismoney
9th November 2004, 02:42
Sorry but it's not created by me, I got it from a friend, and he got it form a forgotten website...

Blight
9th November 2004, 04:20
I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up...

But isn't the MP4 file format pretty much the QuickTime6 MOV format? Why not make the filter accept MOV files and the popular audio/video streams (Sorenson 1/3 Video and QDesign Audio).

timeismoney
9th November 2004, 16:58
Problem with this Splitter + ffdshow + MPC.

When playback to the end, MPC's seekbar won't rewind and MPC can't be closed in normal way. I have to terminate MPC forced.

I tried 7 mp4s, only one is well, MPC's seekbar rewind and can be closed, the left 6 ones including the clip I've given you as "SWAT".

When I use XviD 1.1 alpha to decode mp4 ASP, nothing is wrong.

When I use Zoom Player or WMP, nothing is wrong.

Please, check it and make it compatible with ffdshow + MPC, believe me this "Group" is very popular.

PS: I use MPC 6482 or 6483CVS, same result

bond
9th November 2004, 22:59
Originally posted by Blight
But isn't the MP4 file format pretty much the QuickTime6 MOV format? Why not make the filter accept MOV files and the popular audio/video streams (Sorenson 1/3 Video and QDesign Audio).i assume moonlight develops this splitter for being able to support h.264 (which most commercial tools place in .mp4) more completely in their implementations

Lupus_aka_Den
10th November 2004, 16:56
Originally posted by Blight
I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up...

But isn't the MP4 file format pretty much the QuickTime6 MOV format? Why not make the filter accept MOV files and the popular audio/video streams (Sorenson 1/3 Video and QDesign Audio).
This ability will be realized in the future.

Lupus_aka_Den
10th November 2004, 16:58
Originally posted by bond
i assume moonlight develops this splitter for being able to support h.264 (which most commercial tools place in .mp4) more completely in their implementations
Not for H.264 only 8) I think MPEG-4 Intermedia Format have a big future 8)

Lupus_aka_Den
10th November 2004, 17:00
Originally posted by timeismoney
Problem with this Splitter + ffdshow + MPC.

When playback to the end, MPC's seekbar won't rewind and MPC can't be closed in normal way. I have to terminate MPC forced.

I tried 7 mp4s, only one is well, MPC's seekbar rewind and can be closed, the left 6 ones including the clip I've given you as "SWAT".

When I use XviD 1.1 alpha to decode mp4 ASP, nothing is wrong.

When I use Zoom Player or WMP, nothing is wrong.

Please, check it and make it compatible with ffdshow + MPC, believe me this "Group" is very popular.

PS: I use MPC 6482 or 6483CVS, same result
I'll try to check it, but i want to talk with ffdshow decoder authors before.

bond
11th November 2004, 20:59
when you talk to milan (from ffdshow) you could also consider making the following possible:
its possible to store not only audio and video streams in .mp4, but also pictures (png and jpeg). i already talked to milan about this and he meant that ffdshow is already able to decode png and jpeg, the only problem is that there exists no dshow splitter that is able to pass the pictures to ffdshow from .mp4 (ffdshow would only need to get a specific fourcc from the splitter, eg "jpeg", and should be able to decode the picture)

maybe you would find this interesting too (mp4box for example can mux jpg and png pictures into .mp4 already)

neo75903
16th November 2004, 03:05
Originally posted by timeismoney

Now I found when seeking it will last 1 or 2 secs's frames broken like this:


I think that is normal because you the player needs the next full frame before it can refresh the whole screen.
What you see are the small changes in between those full frames. I have it less while playing a file locally, but it is very appearant when streaming from a server. It is not more then logical cause the player can locally search for the closest full frame and start rebuilding the picture.
I am new to these technical talks but i think those full frames are I frames isnt?

Blight
17th November 2004, 08:09
Yeah, the junk is due to seeking in the middle of a stream instead of seeking to a keyframe and then decoding to the location prior to showing the image.

bond
29th November 2004, 02:00
any news about the development?

Lupus_aka_Den
29th November 2004, 13:55
First of all, I'm sorry for keeping silence for a while as I have been working hard on Muxer.
So: following the previous link the new version of 10.11.2004 is available. This version is announced as a freeze, therefore, all that will be made with this version is just bug fixing, but not new features implementation.
What is done:
- long streams durational parsing bug is fixed;
- crop rectangles for ═.264 are supported;
- PAR signaling for MPEG-4 and H.264 are supported;
- correct operation with Nero H.264 decoder is added;
- crash bug on incorrect muxed stream is fixed, i.e. when one sample lays on the other;
- SubType for MPEG-4 and H.263 is now MPEG2VIDEOINFO;
- support then AnexB H.264 streams descripted in standard "esds" atom;
Full support of ffdshow decoder is postponed, unfortunately.

SeeMoreDigital
29th November 2004, 14:04
Sounds good... thanks Den :D

timeismoney
29th November 2004, 17:26
:p waiting for a stable release, wish to got it soon...

bond
29th November 2004, 21:33
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
This version is announced as a freeze, therefore, all that will be made with this version is just bug fixing, but not new features implementation.sad to here this, cause it would have been great if your splitter could have supported mpeg-4 part17 text/subtitle streams inside .mp4, which is currently already doable as described here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86050)

- crop recnatgles for ═.264 are supported;what does this mean exactly?

- PAR signaling for MPEG-4 and H.264 are supported;what does this mean exactly? are you talking about pars stored in the video bitstream itself or something else? how does the par info get passed to the decoder?

- correct operation with Nero H.264 decoder is added;nice :)

- SubType for MPEG-4 and H.263 is now MPEG2VIDEOINFO;hm, what does this mean? isnt mpeg-4 part2 video passed through marked as "mp4v" anymore or am i mixing things up? what does all this have to do with mpeg2?

Full support of ffdshow decoder is postponed, unfortunately. what was the problem with ffdshow?
what about the divx5, xvid and 3ivx decoders?

Lupus_aka_Den
30th November 2004, 09:04
Originally posted by bond
sad to here this, cause it would have been great if your splitter could have supported mpeg-4 part17 text/subtitle streams inside .mp4, which is currently already doable as described here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86050)
I hope in next versions demuxer this feature will be realizes, but all that will be made with current version is just bug fixing 8)

Originally posted by bond
what does this mean exactly?
Crop rectangles is H.264 feature then video window have specific position. rcSource(rcTarget).left(top) and rcTarget in VIDEOINFOHEADER2 may be not equal zero.

Originally posted by bond
what does this mean exactly? are you talking about pars stored in the video bitstream itself or something else? how does the par info get passed to the decoder?
Support PAR signaling - then picture aspect ratio calculate from MPEG-4 and H.264, and dwPictAspectRatioX, dwPictAspectRatioY fields in VIDEOINFOHEADER2 fills.

Originally posted by bond
hm, what does this mean? isnt mpeg-4 part2 video passed through marked as "mp4v" anymore or am i mixing things up? what does all this have to do with mpeg2?
In last version SubType for MPEG-4 and H.263 was FORMAT_VideoInfo. But VIDEOINFOHEADER does'nt support picture aspect ratio 8) Therefore i choose FORMAT_VideoInfo2 and MPEG2VIDEOINFO structure.

Originally posted by bond
what was the problem with ffdshow?
Some problems with seeking and playing. But in next year ffdshow decoder will be supported completely.

Originally posted by bond
what about the divx5, xvid and 3ivx decoders?
3ivx decoder same times swear on sample start and end times. I do not understand why 8(

timeismoney
12th December 2004, 07:32
http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/img/neroavc_heaac.mp4

A NeroRecode encoded clip, can be demuxed by moonlight, but audio is broken...

Use NeroRecode itself is OK

And wish mp3 in mp4 can be demuxed soon

By the way, if installed NeroRecode, moonlight MP4 demuxer will be entirely broken and unusable, even disable NDParser.ax by MMViewer, I have to unreg NDParser.ax to make moonlight MP4 demuxer usable. This is a serious problem!

Lupus_aka_Den
12th December 2004, 08:28
Originally posted by timeismoney
http://down.bbsbird.com/ringz/img/neroavc_heaac.mp4

A NeroRecode encoded clip, can be demuxed by moonlight, but audio is broken...

Use NeroRecode itself is OK
Thanks. I'll check it
Originally posted by timeismoney
And wish mp3 in mp4 can be demuxed soon
MP3-in-MP4 is supported. I have a two streams with mp3 and my demuxer working properly
Originally posted by timeismoney
By the way, if installed NeroRecode, moonlight MP4 demuxer will be entirely broken and unusable, even disable NDParser.ax by MMViewer, I have to unreg NDParser.ax to make moonlight MP4 demuxer usable. This is a serious problem!
Interesting... I'll try to install Nero Recode and look that happened

timeismoney
12th December 2004, 11:54
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Interesting... I'll try to install Nero Recode and look that happened Just install Nero Burning Rom 6.6.0.3, this will happen

timeismoney
13th December 2004, 11:03
http://203.252.53.117/jw_wang/Download/Myringz/0.mp4

Stop at the first frame, both MPC and WMP

Use nero's parser is OK, please check it.

yaz
13th December 2004, 11:19
Originally posted by timeismoney
Just install Nero Burning Rom 6.6.0.3, this will happen sure. imho, dsf in nbr 6601 was a 'failure' from ahead :-) dsf worked pretty fine, chained in every graph well but when updated to 6603 all went wrong. at the moment i must unreg ndparser.ax so as to get back my earlier .mp4 support and still i'm not sure how to get back nero asp support. that's pity :-(
the bests
y

SeeMoreDigital
13th December 2004, 11:38
Talking about Nero's filters.

Some time ago I noticed that some of the "same named" filters in Nero Burning ROM Nero's can be different versions to those in Nero VisionExpress, for the same dated release... Maybe it's this that's causing some of your problems?

Originally posted by timeismoney
http://203.252.53.117/jw_wang/Download/Myringz/0.mp4

Stop at the first frame, both MPC and WMP

Use nero's parser is OK, please check it. QuickTime player can also play the encode ok

What tools to you use to create and mux the streams?


Cheers

timeismoney
13th December 2004, 12:10
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Talking about Nero's filters.

Some time ago I noticed that some of the "same named" filters in Nero Burning ROM Nero's can be different to those in Nero VisionExpress, for the same dated release... Maybe it's this that's causing some of your problems?


Cheers I tried Nero VisionExpress, too, same result

And BTW, well, I just found that nero's NDParser.ax (Both from latest NBR and NVE) will cause AAC Parser broken and unusable, too. Shit!:devil:

So I think it may cause another error, well I test more, same result.

3ivx Media Splitter
AAC Parser
Moonlight MP4 Demultiplexer
dicas Codec

Both broken after nero installed, and nero's compatibility is not good enough, many common mp4s can't be demuxed correctly

those codec can only be usable by uninstall nero

This time Nero is too aggressive

timeismoney
13th December 2004, 12:14
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
QuickTime player can also play the encode ok

What tools to you use to create and mux the streams?


Cheers Sorry that clip was not created by me, a friend of mine sent it to us...

DeathTheSheep
18th December 2004, 06:58
Now I --a straggling, lone sheep-- trot in a bit late and happen to remark in a squeaky, shy tone:

"Um, uh, how do you install this neat thingee? I want to demux my NeroDigtal sheep butchering tapes into a neat avc1..." (sheep butchering tapes are made up)

Yes, so, I (the Deathly Sheep) just need to know how to install this thing, having missed the pdf that came with earlier versions of the beta (the current one has only the .ax file, and I have no clue what to do with it....)

Cheers, Baa

celtic_druid
18th December 2004, 09:08
You need to register it.
regsvr32.exe mp4splitter.ax or whatever.

DeathTheSheep
19th December 2004, 17:11
[The sheep bows in a guesture of submission]

Ah, yes, thank you much.

But this brings about anothier problem: How can I use this like the non-AVC compliant 3ivx splitter to mux into an AVI? I know it's possible to have AVC in AVI (think x264, VideoSoft, hdot264, NeroDigital when applied in GraphEdit, I think)...

So, is there an AVI-muxing solution? Because nothing I own (portable vid player, PocketPC, some wierd portable DVD player, video editing software, player, etc) supports this new-but-still-clunky MP4 thing. If only that stupid container could more easily give up its data to an AVI, baaaa.

Cheers. Baaah.

DeathTheSheep
20th December 2004, 03:36
http://img90.exs.cx/img90/3322/graphedit7sd.jpg

SeeMoreDigital
20th December 2004, 11:44
Originally posted by DeathTheSheep
Screenshot (won't let me stick it into previoius post--no attachment button, lol): Upload your screenshot and any other useful images via, http://www.ImageShack.us/


Cheers

timeismoney
20th December 2004, 16:34
http://tinypic.com/

is OK

DeathTheSheep
23rd December 2004, 16:51
Yeah, thanks guys! So, now that it's done and over with, is there any way (with the new demultiplexor or anything) to get the streams into an avi? I heard there was a filter called "MP4_input_0" or something and ones called "dump" or something, but since they aren't in my list, I can't use 'em, lol. So, is this normal that this doesn't work? Can I mux two dumped streams into an AVI if I find out where to get the "dump" filters?

bond
23rd December 2004, 19:04
ok i now found the time to test this myself

my first and most important finding is that because of this:
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
In last version SubType for MPEG-4 and H.263 was FORMAT_VideoInfo. But VIDEOINFOHEADER does'nt support picture aspect ratio 8) Therefore i choose FORMAT_VideoInfo2 and MPEG2VIDEOINFO structure.i am not able anymore to connect the moonlight mp4 demultiplexer to neither moonlights own h.264 decoder (latest one taken from the 1.0.8 player), nor ffdshow, because the splitter doesnt output "avc1" anymore but this mpeg2 related stuff (which of course has nothing to do with avc-in-mp4 and therefore isnt understood).
i hope this will be changed back again, making the spliter output "avc1" as before...


with the version before, playing avc-in-mp4 streams seems to work fine (one file (provided by philips) muxed from raw to mp4 with mp4creator showed some smearing, will have to check that more closely (other muxes (reference, moonlight) worked. files encoded with ateme and fhg worked too)
when seeking there were some crashes (one time in mp4demux, one in h264dec) with files encoded with the ateme encoder (no such problems with fhg), also seeking didnt work that smoothly with ateme files than with fhg ones
note that the ateme file used b-frames, but fhg didnt (maybe b-frames arent supported correctly till now in avc?)

playback of mp2/mp3-in-mp4 (muxed with mp4creator) worked fine, mp3-in-mp4 muxed with mp4box crashed (in the default windows mp3 decoder) - first thought that it might be mp4box's fault, but the 3ivx splitter handles the same file correctly (with the windows mp3 decoder too)

normal mpeg-4 asp video (3 cons. b-frames) in mp4 (muxed with mp4box) works

Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
- PAR signaling for MPEG-4 and H.264 are supportedwith the latest splitter version, i tried 3 different mpeg-4 asp files having PAR signalled in the bitstream (created with 3ivx and xvid) and all three werent resized during playback, also all three showed choppy playback (note that the 3ivx sample didnt use b-frames, the xvid samples used 2 and 3 max consecutive b-frames)

all tests done with moonlight's own av decoders

bond
30th December 2004, 21:21
i can confirm that when using moonlights .mp4 splitter together with moonlights h.264 decoder, when manually forcing overlay mixer to be used (moonlights decoder doesnt do that by itself automatically), PAR in AVC resizing works correctly :)

bond
5th January 2005, 02:06
i have an addition to the problems this splitter has with avc b-frames atm:
as ffdshow supports now avc b-frame decoding too, i tried it with this splitter and it always crashes is "libavcodec.dll" right at the beginning of the playback (first frame gets shown). files not using b-frames work fine (didnt try seeking)

note that the files using b-frames (as also the ones without) get played fine with ffdshow when using the nero .mp4 parser, so there might be a problem in the moonlight splitter regarding b-frames

timeismoney
5th January 2005, 04:05
Originally posted by bond
i have an addition to the problems this splitter has with avc b-frames atm:
as ffdshow supports now avc b-frame decoding too, i tried it with this splitter and it always crashes is "libavcodec.dll" right at the beginning of the playback (first frame gets shown). files not using b-frames work fine (didnt try seeking)

note that the files using b-frames (as also the ones without) get played fine with ffdshow when using the nero .mp4 parser, so there might be a problem in the moonlight splitter regarding b-frames Yes, I tried ffdshow cvs 0105, it decode avc with b-frames very well via nero's parser, but often crash via this demuxer. Seeking will cause the player auto close or crash, too - even avc without b-frames, mp4v is OK.

The picture below is the error message when seeking an avc without b-frames, I also repported to milan. PS: via Nero's parser is fine, no any problem.

http://tinypic.com/166h6d

Lupus_aka_Den
6th January 2005, 05:54
Thanks a lot for the messages and tests of the demuxer.
Unfortunately I can't deal with it now as I'm seriously busy with the muxer. In the nearest future I'll definitely study all your remarks and make a more crash-proof program version with
additional features. 8)

timeismoney
6th January 2005, 08:50
Originally posted by Lupus_aka_Den
Thanks a lot for the messages and tests of the demuxer.
Unfortunately I can't deal with it now as I'm seriously busy with the muxer. In the nearest future I'll definitely study all your remarks and make a more crash-proof program version with
additional features. 8) BTW:

milan said
After seeking Moonlight's demuxer doesn't wait for next keyframe to start delivering frames and libavcodec can't handle this.And wish it will be more stable.

xanthian23
25th January 2005, 02:29
:cool: For the love of pete, all I wanted to know is how to get avisynth to recognise the avc files. Like what command do I use. Obviously it's not gonna be directshowsource, tried that already. I just want to find something to get avs to recognise avc so I can re-encode avc files to other formats with any encoder that accepts avs. All this other stuff is interesting, but way past what i'm lookin for. Does anybody know what plugins i need, and what command line to use to get avs to accept avc?:cool:

celtic_druid
25th January 2005, 04:29
Unless someone writes an mp4 plugin then directshowsource() is the only way that you are going to frameserve an mp4 with AVISynth. If it doesn't work directly with the mp4, then you could try opening it in graphedit and frameserving the graph file.

Koti
25th January 2005, 04:31
Someone correct me if wrong, but the only way I can think you will re-encode a avc is to decode it to huffyuv and pcm audio in graphedit.
This will require your PC has the appropriate splitters/decoders.

file<->Video<->ffdsho-decode<->huffyuv-encode<->avimux<->New.avi
file<->Audio<---------->aac decoder<-----------------^
Then you could frame serve that to anything

MSlv
5th March 2005, 19:57
how can I make this the default mp4 demultiplexer? I mean... how can I use it? I only have MP4Demux.ax. How does it work?

celtic_druid
5th March 2005, 21:01
You neeed to regsvr32 it and make sure that it is the mp4 splitter with the highest merit or set specific overrides in your player.