V0.65 - Audio Drop problem not fixed yet

[DVD Maniac]

Firstly a big thankyou to jdobbs for the ongoing development efforts and the kind inclusion on the VIP list!

I have been so busy with work stuff lately that I have not been able to test the last 2 or 3 releases of RB. So when v0.65 arrived I set aside some time to do a test with my old problem child movie (Paycheck) to see if the annoying audio drop problem had been finally sorted.

Alas, the drops are still there - exactly as they were in previous versions. :(

For those who were experiencing the problem before, have any of the recent releases fixed the problem for you?

Jdobbs - what's your view on this? Have you now explored all the likely causes for this problem (reading the readme's its clear you have been doing a lot of changes to the rebuild code which I was hoping would cure the problem)

[dannyv]

Originally posted by DVD Maniac
So when v0.65 arrived I set aside some time to do a test with my old problem child movie (Paycheck) to see if the annoying audio drop problem had been finally sorted.

Alas, the drops are still there - exactly as they were in previous versions. :(


Is it the PAL or NTSC version. I have the NTSC version and I'm going to test it to see if I can reproduce the problem.

Please tell me where the audio dropouts are and if you have done any preprocessing on it?

[DVD Maniac]

Its the PAL version and the drops occur when the opening sequence starts after the Dreamworks title. Thay are evry 2-3 seconds.

jdobbs has tried to find the problem with the actual vob I sent him - not sure what happended with that.

I have done some pre-processing, but only on the non movie titlesets and have not touched the main movie titleset source. Besides, I have experienced the problem on movies that I have totally intact as their original structure

[jptheripper]

if you dont mind running again, try preparing, loading into rb-opt and intentionally lowering the bitrates on just that section to very low values (ie like 2000) so we can be assured it isnt spiking over spec. This would at least isolate/eliminate it as a possibility

[TheSeeker]

@jptheripper

I think that bitrate spike over spec has actually been ruled out as the source because Jdobbs has added code to specifically prevent these spikes from going over the dvd standard of 10000. This includes the combined bitrates from all the audio streams and video streams and subtitles.

[jptheripper]

i think it would be interesting to find out if these occur at cell boundries or within cell also

[eriksen76]

Originally posted by TheSeeker
@jptheripper

I think that bitrate spike over spec has actually been ruled out as the source because Jdobbs has added code to specifically prevent these spikes from going over the dvd standard of 10000. This includes the combined bitrates from all the audio streams and video streams and subtitles.

Agreed, I just tryed again to lower the bitrate with RBOPT at the "drop out erea". Same problem

/Julius

[DVD Maniac]

Agreed, I just tryed again to lower the bitrate with RBOPT at the "drop out erea". Same problem

Sounds like I am not the only one still having these problems. I have pretty much eliminited all of the possible causes to this through some very extensive tests in the past (including the bit rate). I have even remuxed the .m2v using other programs to see if the actual .m2v was corrupt - it wasn't. There is definitely something going on in the final rebuilding stage which is creating small errors in the resulting vob's which a minority of players are unable to cope with. :confused:

[k-c-ksum]

maybe you could try this. After the rebuild is complete. Demux the video and audio.Using dvddecrypter Ya will have an audio file and 1 large video. Then author these using ifoedit. This will give you a movie only copy. play it back, are the audio dropouts still there? if so :(

If not then you can re-insert the main movie vobs back into the earlier rebuilder version. And ifoupdate it.

[eriksen76]

Originally posted by k-c-ksum
maybe you could try this. After the rebuild is complete. Demux the video and audio.Using dvddecrypter Ya will have an audio file and 1 large video. Then author these using ifoedit. This will give you a movie only copy. play it back, are the audio dropouts still there? if so :(

If not then you can re-insert the main movie vobs back into the earlier rebuilder version. And ifoupdate it.

When you demux with eg. ifoedit or Dvdmaestro the errors are gone. I've tryed it lots of times.

You're right that you can incorporate the titles set and then update with ifoupdate.

But remember:

YOU CAN ONLY DO SO IF YOU'RE DEALING WITH A SINGLE PGC TITLESET.

And what I like most about Dvdrebuilder is that its able to deal with "multi pgc titles-set movies".

So if the problem somehow should get solved I would be very very very pleased. But somehow I think it will ever get solved. I seems like a pain in the ... finding the solution.

/Julius

[Sir Didymus]

@k-c-ksum & Eriksen76

Hi, guys :)

Of course the suggestion of using other authoring tools, as a cure, is just a little sustainable (and not at all satisfying): I mean, what about muxing more than one audio tracks ? and multiple subtitles ? and multiple angles ? DVD-RB is in some way special, because it is using a very general and strong approach...

It is interesting anyway as a debugging tool for understanding what is going wrong for the very few ppl suffering from the drops.

I am not among them, but I did some testings, using different profiling, authoring and remuxing tools...

It's not so easy to explain the reason (and it is just a feeling, nothing more), but I tend to think that one of the causes could be connected to situations of STD buffer overflowing (produced by remuxing timings glitches and not by bitrate speaks in itself...)...

I know it a pain to discuss about "ISO standards rules"; it could be misleading, and it can require a lot of coding work in DVD-RB, that most probably leads to nothing, or even to generate big troubles to every user, trying to attach a problem that is afflicting just few ppl (as it has been demonstrated with the runt vobu situation).

So, I'd really prefere to take the whole matter with a lot of calm, waiting to collect real, precise, and USEFUL evidence about problems before posting something...

Ok. in the meanwhile maybe I will start a new thread just for sharing some preliminary findings, and to try to show better what I mean...

For the moment what I see regarding the production of compliant authored material (compliant respect to the buffer overflow issue) using different authoring tools, is the following:

Ifoedit - Not compliant. Please note, on this point, my findings are different from the ones of Eriksen76...
Mplex - Not compliant.
DVD-RB 065 - Not compliant.
DvdLab - Much better but still not compliant in some cases.
DvdLabPro B14 - fully compliant - buffer usage satisfying.
Scenarist - fully compliant - buffer usage perfect.

Cheers
SD

[k-c-ksum]

how about a fake strip in ifoedit just to redo all the navpacks?

[eriksen76]

Originally posted by k-c-ksum
how about a fake strip in ifoedit just to redo all the navpacks?

Doesn't work, I tryed it a while ago. But I had the same thought.

/Julius

[jptheripper]

If you have access to DvdRemake

import into REmake then export (making no adjustments). Remake will auto correct navpacks..

its worth a shot