Dirac - A Wavelet based Codec by BBC

[iwod]

BBC begins open-source streaming challenge


The BBC is quietly preparing a challenge to Microsoft and other companies jostling to reap revenues from video streams. It is developing code-decode (codec) software called Dirac in an open-source project aimed at providing a royalty-free way to distribute video .

The sums at stake are potentially huge because the software industry insists on payment per viewer, per hour of encoded content. This contrasts with TV technology, for which viewers and broadcasters alike make a one-off royalties payment when they buy their equipment.



Read the whole article here (http://uk.news.yahoo.com/040812/175/f06i1.html)

Listed in Sourceforge (http://sourceforge.net/projects/dirac/)

[Tommy Carrot]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=75387

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77561

[lexor]

Tommy those threads are more announcement like, however what's interesting today is that BBC actually decided to replace Real video streaming with Dirac.

BTW I recall some members tried Dirac back when it was first announced and they complained about slowness, can those members comment if something has been done on that front?

[damrod]

cool if it works i can work again on my gui for encoding? ;-)

[Tommy Carrot]

Originally posted by lexor
Tommy those threads are more announcement like, however what's interesting today is that BBC actually decided to replace Real video streaming with Dirac.I know, but this news is actually not a big surprise, their intention was clear from the beginning: a royalty free codec for streaming/broadcasting.
BTW I recall some members tried Dirac back when it was first announced and they complained about slowness, can those members comment if something has been done on that front? It seems to me the devs are still trying to find the most optimal class-structure for the codec, so i don't expect too much speed and quality improvements since the earlier versions.

[Sirber]

Wasn't this the goal of theora?

[Tommy Carrot]

Theora is based on an old and obsolete codec, so it cannot really compete with the latest codecs, and anyway, it's still not finished, and at this pace it probably never will be.

[Joe Fenton]

I've used VP3, the codec Theora is derived from. It's competitive with MPG4 codecs at moderate and higher bitrates. Theora is tuned a little better to work even better.

You don't keep up with Theora status very well - it's been "finished" since June 1.

From their page:
[ 2004 Jun 1 - Theora I bitstream freeze ]

Big news. The Theora I bitstream format is now frozen! This means it's safe to start distributing videos in the theora format.

It's about as "finished" as xvid. :D

[Tommy Carrot]

Originally posted by Joe Fenton
I've used VP3, the codec Theora is derived from. It's competitive with MPG4 codecs at moderate and higher bitrates. Theora is tuned a little better to work even better.


I don't know how did you get that result... VP3 seems like if a strong smoother filter was applied on the image, everything is blurry and the details are missing even at high bitrates... and the current Theora is not much better than that. Yes, it's watchable because the lack of artifacts, but mpeg4 is amazingly more detailed and sharper. And the blurriness is not there because of the postfiltering, the same is true even if it's off.

I'm aware of the frozen state of the bitstream, but i still didn't see any usable theora codec, so i would say dirac is not that far behind, and it seems much more promising than theora.

[Phanton_13]

The VP3 in the build 3.2.6.1 has 3 sharpness configuration ( high detail , normal , smooth ) in the other hand the actual mpeg4 are more developed than vp3 but it is equal of old. the Theora is a reality much configurable codec and it can obtain a good result without problems.
if you like to see a real encoding in theora without improvementes ( vp3 like ), in the theora site are a bittorrent file of the Creative Commons movie Honey, you only ned a compatible player.

[Joe Fenton]

I neglected to say I used the Mac version of VP3. Yes, it's the same codec as the Windows version, but I could never get the Windows version to encode half as good as the Mac version. The encodes I made on the Mac were easily as good as the .9 version of xvid.

I was obviously missing a setting that the Mac was using, but I was just experimenting, so I didn't look into any further. On the PC, xvid was easier to use. My PC is considerably faster than my old iMac, so I used xvid instead of VP3 on the Mac due to time constraints (hours vs. days encoding).

I've got my system set up to play OGG-Theora, but I really need to try encoding with it to see how it compares to xvid 1.0. I expect xvid will be better, but Theora should be pretty decent. The key point for some folks is that OGG-Theora has no patent issues (it has patents, but On allows their use).

[Tommy Carrot]

@Joe

I had a déja vu feeling about this discussion, and indeed (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=376537#post376537). :D But if it's true, i cannot comprehend how can the windows version be so inferior to the mac version, they should be nearly identical. And as i said a long time ago, on windows VP3 is often worse than mpeg1.

[Joe Fenton]

I had the same feeling. Freaky. :cool:

I wouldn't use VP3 for encoding in general because of the poor PC support. I haven't made up my mind on Theora yet. I need to try it on all three platforms first (Mac, Linux, Windows).

I'm not likely to change to it though since xvid 1.0 is so good. It'll take another major improvement in codecs to get me to change - like maybe a good h.264 codec hits the street.

[unmei]

Theora is based on an old and obsolete codec
That's what i feel a bit weird about as well. IIRC even Rududu looked better than VP3 (Windos is the only i know), and it was made by 1 person and haven't yet seen a long history of optimisation.
But then again, i have a hard time believeing Xiph would have even accepted On2's offer for a free VP3 if they had not seen ways to improve it much. I mean, the other Xiph codecs are pretty good (mm its audio, maybe they just have no clue of video?) and room for improvement is always there, just look at DivX 3.11 vs Xvid 1.0.1. Heh isn't VP3 even from around the DivX 3.11 days?