DVD-5 -> DVD±R without FBI logos ?

[iparout]

Hi there.

I would lie to backup the 9th gate DVD which is a single layer disc, so I decided to do it usind the following guide :

http://www.doom9.org/mpg/dvd5-backup.htm

Before I start the process though, I would like to ask a couple questions :

1) In original DVDs there are some logos (FBI logos, studio logos, WARNING logos e.t.c) which, while they are displayed, do not let you to fast forward through them or change the chapter (these options are greyed out in PowerDVD). By following the guide above, does the final DVD+R disc contain these logos like the original DVD does, i.e. without being able to change the chapter or fast-forward while those logos are displayed ? If yes, is there any other similarly simple way to backup DVD 5 -> 1 DVD+R disc, giving me the opportunity to be able to fast forward or change the chapter while these logos are displayed in the final DVD+R disc ? I don't care if the logos are displayed or not, I just need to fast forward through them in case I want to...

2) Since this guide is quite old (last update was 2002), is there any more up-to-date guide for DVD 5 -> DVD+R backup ?

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Kedirekin]

Fast forward and chapter skip are prevented by PUOP (prohibited user operations). As long as you remove POUPs you will be to fast forward through the warnings and intros. Skipping past them may not work, as warnings and intros are typically titles unto themselves, each with only one chapter.

I do not know if PUOP removal is on by default in DVDDecrypter, but I have it enabled and I don't remember ever explicitly turning it on.

I don't know what you mean about the guides being old. When I looked at them they say they were last updated in March 2004 - just a couple of months old.

[iparout]

Originally posted by Kedirekin
Fast forward and chapter skip are prevented by PUOP (prohibited user operations). As long as you remove POUPs you will be to fast forward through the warnings and intros. Skipping past them may not work, as warnings and intros are typically titles unto themselves, each with only one chapter.

I do not know if PUOP removal is on by default in DVDDecrypter, but I have it enabled and I don't remember ever explicitly turning it on.

I don't know what you mean about the guides being old. When I looked at them they say they were last updated in March 2004 - just a couple of months old.

Thanks for the help.

1) Regarding the PUO, I have found two options in the DVD Decrypter settings : Remove IFO/BUP PUOs and Remove VOB PUOs. They are both unchecked by default. I should check them both, right ?

2) As for the guides being old, I am not referring to all guides generally, I am just referring to the "DVD-5 -> DVD±R
- using DVD Decrypter - last updated on 02/04/02". Although when I open the guide it says "This document was last updated on March 15, 2004"... Oh well, I guess it doesn;t make any difference.

3) One last thing... There are some original DVDs where you cannot move throughout the movie using the cursor on PowerDVD, which means that if you want to go to a specific part of the movie, you have to fast forward and wait for the movie to play (in fast forward mode) until it reaches the part you want (this happens often in the cast interviews, deleted scenes, extra material e.t.c.). Can this be changed when creating DVD+R backups ?

[Joergen]

Sometimes removing the PUOP for those logos will cause weirdness when you skip them. Best way imo is to remove them using titlesetblanker or vobblanker (if they reside in their own VTS, or coupled with something equally disposable like a studio logo).

DVDStripper and DVDRemake can take them out for you aswell but if your disc has disney-style dvd "games", the current versions of these software might screw those up.

[Kedirekin]

1) I believe you only need to remove IFO/BUP PUOPs to enable FF and skip.

As Joergen states, skipping titles can produce strange behavior; not only warnings and intros, but other titles as well. It impossible to see inside the player firmware to see why, but I believe it's because skipping off of a title bypasses the PGC post commands, and sometimes those post commands are necessary for proper playback. Better to just get in the habit of using fast forward - I've never seen a disk screw up when you do that (don't fast forward on menus though; in my experience that sometimes messes up button highlighting, and it's hard to navigate a menu when you can't see what button you're on).

If I understand correctly, removing vob PUOPs can also produce strange behavior. For example, it can sometimes cause a subtitle track to be turned on by default, which is irritating.

2) I suspect Doom9 just missed that date when he updated the guide. Unless it's a typo, the date in the guide itself is the more accurate - but you're right - it doesn't matter as long as the guide is accurate.

3) No idea.

[iparout]

So, as far as I can understand, it's not the "removing PUOs" action that may yield strange results, it's skipping those logos that does it, so if I enable the "remove PUOs" in DVD Decrypter and then fast forward through those logos (instead of skipping them), everything will be fine, right ?

And finally, since I am now a bit confused about this, should I just enable the "remove IFO/BUP PUOs" option or the "remove VOB PUOs" as well ?

[Kedirekin]

That's my understanding. The studios disable skip because it can cause issues (sometimes) and they disable fast forward simply because they want to force us to watch stuff. Removing a PUOP has no effect, but invoking the operation can. In my experience, fast forwarding never causes issues, but skipping can. Let me stress that that is my experience - I'm not omniscient; I could be wrong.

I have both IFO/BUP and VOB PUO removal enabled, but then I don't care much about minor inconveniences. In order to fast forward through intros and warnings, I think you at least have to enable IFO/BUP PUO removal. Enabling VOB PUO removal is entirely up to you.

[Joergen]

As far as I have gathered and tested, blanking with titlesetblanker or dvdremake still executes stuff during those blanked out titles. I havent had any problems with blanking so far.

[k2]

All good responses but I prefer to use DVDshrink in re-author mode for this. It is true that no shrink is needed so is very quick. It just makes a quick movie only. Removing the warning and intros while keeping the menus can be done with VOBblanker but I find it too time consuming.

[OvERaCiD23]

No matter what you do, you're going to have to extract the files from the DVD (ISO I'm assuming). You have a few options on what to do: blank the titles and let original playback order continue or change the IFO navigation commands. I actually prefer a combination of the latter; I blank the sections to save a little space and then modify the commands to skip over those (otherwise you jump around to 5 titles or so and I dislike the way it makes my DVD player moan from all the laser movement). Check out the "IFO Editing" forum; there's quite a bit of knowledge in there that will help you with this.

[jel]

3) One last thing... There are some original DVDs where you cannot move throughout the movie using the cursor on PowerDVD, which means that if you want to go to a specific part of the movie, you have to fast forward and wait for the movie to play (in fast forward mode) until it reaches the part you want i believe this is a result of the authored dvd not having a TMAPTI Timetable.
the only way i could think of correcting this would be to re-author the dvd in a high end authoring application (like scenarist) and create a new tmaapti timetable.
imho it would not be worth the headache tho for this minor inconvenience.

edit:/ found a tool by jsoto that may be of help (although i think it only corrects and updates the tmapti table, not creates a new one)
avliable here: http://www.iespana.es/jsoto/
and for those of you interested, this explanation was in the readme tmapti is an IFO table which stores vob lbas corresponding to nav packs. It is used by the settops or SW players to navigate directly to one point of the title (i.e. when moving the progress bar of a SW player to access to some point)

[Dimad]

Originally posted by jel
i believe this is a result of the authored dvd not having a TMAPTI Timetable.
the only way i could think of correcting this would be to re-author the dvd in a high end authoring application (like scenarist) and create a new tmaapti timetable.

DvdReMake will create it as well.