Encoding 5.1 OGG/AAC at 128kbps ?

[Lagoon]

Hi, I've been trying with various tools (oggmachine,oagmachine,headac3he)

Seems not one of them goes down to 128kbps ? I always get oversized result (~200kbps)

In headac3he I couldn't even go lower than 192 for OGG.

OGGmachine just doesn't work, crash with (I'm not using ABR but VBR, and no SSRC):

BeSweet v1.5b25 by DSPguru.
--------------------------
Using azid.dll v1.9 (b922) by Midas (midas@egon.gyaloglo.hu).
Using Ogg Vorbis v1.0 dlls (http://www.vorbis.com).
Manual Dynamic-Compression algorithm by LigH (author of WaveBooster).

Logging start : 03/13/04 , 19:27:40.

G:\video\_Tools_\besweet\BeSweet.exe -core( -input D:\video\VTS_01_1 - 0x81 - Audio - AC3 - 6ch - 48kHz - DRC - Français - DELAY 0ms.ac3 -output D:\video\VTS_01_1 - 0x81 - Audio - AC3 - 6ch - 48kHz - DRC - Français - DELAY 0ms.ogg -logfilea G:\DVDR\_Tools_\besweet\BeSweet.log ) -ota( -hybridgain ) -boost( /b=2db ) -ogg( -b 128 -m 0 -M 256 -6ch ) -profile( The OggMachine v0.62 )

[00:00:00:000] +------- BeSweet -----
[00:00:00:000] | Input : D:\video\VTS_01_1 - 0x81 - Audio - AC3 - 6ch - 48kHz - DRC - Français - DELAY 0ms.ac3
[00:00:00:000] | Output: D:\video\VTS_01_1 - 0x81 - Audio - AC3 - 6ch - 48kHz - DRC - Français - DELAY 0ms.ogg
[00:00:00:000] | Floating-Point Process: Yes
[00:00:00:000] | PostGain normalize to : 0.97
Error 68: 6chogg only works with 48khz streams.
Gain & Dynamic Compression should be set against azid.

Quiting...
[00:00:00:000] Conversion Completed !

Logging ends : 03/13/04 , 19:27:40.

Source is 48Khz AC3..


OagMachine works fine with AAC encode, but the result is oversized (~200kbps instead of 128)

If anyone has an idea ;)

Thanks.

[bond]

dont use ogg vorbis on that low bitrates!

when encoding with aac, tick he-aac and not lc-aac! also what other settings did you use in the nero interface?

[Lagoon]

I used 48kbits HE-AAC when converting stereo files to HE-AAC with nero, but does it have anything to do with oagmachine ? Nero doesn't support 5.1 encoding.


I just tried to encode with various nero settings (maybe it keeps nero settings on the dll?), it's still encoding always at the same bitrate (~200) regardless of the quality factor (0.400 for ~126kbps, tried down to 57kbps)

Edit : lol sorry for the trouble I didn't notice the show config dialog on oagmachine, shame on me..

Another thing, should I enable "PNS" ? Nero recommend it for very low bitrates.

[bond]

Originally posted by Lagoon
[B]I used 48kbits HE-AAC when converting stereo files to HE-AAC with nero, but does it have anything to do with oagmachine ? Nero doesn't support 5.1 encoding.oagmachine and besweet use the encoder dlls from nero, you have to put them into the same folder as these guis
read the faq!

Another thing, should I enable "PNS" ? Nero recommend it for very low bitrates.good question, maybe for 128kbps multichannel it makes sense, you will have to test it yourself :)

but the most important thing is that you use he-aac! its definitely much better than lc-aac for your purpose!

[Lagoon]

Yes they're in the same folder otherwise it wouldn't even encode :)

Seems PNS is only available for VBR mode, I get oversized results with VBR even with the 100-120kbps preset, I just started a 128kbps HE-AAC CBR encode and there wasn't a PNS option, but at least the size seems right :)

I hope it's really encoding with HE-AAC since the preset said LC-AAC but I changed it in the box below to HE-AAC.

[Soulhunter]

Wow, 5.1 channels @ 128kbps... :eek:

Could this really sound decent ???

I already dislike 128kbps for stereo files... :o


Bye

[Lagoon]

? HE-AAC sounds OK at 32kbits stereo for most movies and great at 64kbits.

Well IMO at least :D

[bond]

he-aac is a must for multichannel, also using vbr is better qualitywise, as its a superior technology and better tuned in nero

128kbps is surely the lowest bitrate on which multichannel should be used, but if you want to put lotr on 1cd its a must :D

for a quality comparison between he-aac@64kbps and lame-mp3@128kbps look here:

http://rarewares.hydrogenaudio.org/rja/plot12.png

its not that far and maybe comparable to what a normal mp3 encoder brings @128kbps

[Lagoon]

Yeah that's what i'm experimenting, about 3-4 hours of good quality on 700MB.

I've found RV10 is awesome at low bitrates, now I need a good 5.1 low bitrate encoder :D

Edit : The VBR preset that corresponds to 128kbps for 5.1 is the Tape (Lowest) 30-40kbps one (which sounds about right since 128/6 = ~21 per channel)

[P0l1m0rph1c]

Originally posted by Lagoon

Seems PNS is only available for VBR mode, I get oversized results with VBR even with the 100-120kbps preset, I just started a 128kbps HE-AAC CBR encode and there wasn't a PNS option, but at least the size seems right :)

I hope it's really encoding with HE-AAC since the preset said LC-AAC but I changed it in the box below to HE-AAC.

These presets are made thinking about stereo encoding. Try 40-50 Kbps VBR preset, HE-AAC. That should be close to 128 kbps with 5.1 content.

EDIT: 30-40 kbps should be a little lower than 128 kbps. Theoretically it should be between 90-120 kbps. Try 40-50 kbps profile.

[Lagoon]

Yeah, in fact 30-40 is about 110kbps and 40-50 ~140kbps.

140kbps sounds good :)