Scenarist experts, How to play as single clips or "play all"?

[Jeff D]

I've got time with Scenarist and I'm pretty comfortable with the basics, but I've got a new problem and no idea how to solve it.

I have two long clips taken from an animation LD, part of the disc is telecined and the other is video source. I created two mpeg files one for interlaced and one for progressive. Using AVISynth IVTC and other clean up on the progressive sequences. The result is a nice set of interlaced and progressive sequences.

What I want to be able to do is select single clips that will play and when finished return to the menu. Chapters worked well. It seems that if I create a title set with two instances of the same clip I don't waste disc space, which is good. I can select single menu items to go to specific chapters, play and return to the menu.(not really sure how I did this, it was months ago) The play all is simple just play the complete track.

There are problems with my technique... if I select a single clip and play I can rew back past the start of the clip, back to a previous clip. Not what I wanted.

How could this be done? I've thought about the scripting, but don't know much about dvd scripting, but could see that a play all flag could be used to decide if playing through chapter stops would correct.

Do I need to take a video segment and chop it up X times to create a single track for each clip? I think this won't work because there will now be wasted space for each single and the long play all clip. Could I string all the singles together with post commands?

Anyone done this? How did you do it?

[Dimmer]

Yeah, you'll have to learn some primitive scripting techniques. First of all, you have to create a separate title for each clip. Doesn't matter whether you have a separate track for each clip or one long track split in scenes.

Next, use any GPRM (it's like an int variable in other programming languages) as a flag indicating whether you selected a clip or Play All. For example, assume that GPRM0=0 if play clip, GPRM0=1 if play all. Due to the specifics of the command we're going to use next, you'll also have to use another GPRM as a constant. As a first Pre command of First PGC put:
1. Mov GPRM1, 1

In Post commands of title 1, put:
1. if ( GPRM0 == GPRM1 ) JumpVTS_TT Title_2
2. CallSS RSM=1, RootMenu

For title 2, change Title_2 to Title_3 etc. meaning jump to the next title if GPRM0=1 else return to the root menu where we assume select clip and Play All buttons are located.

For the last title do this instead:
1. Mov GPRM0, 0
2. CallSS RSM=1, RootMenu

You don't need to perform that check for the last title, it should always reset Play All flag and go to the root menu.

Now we have to assign button commands and set the Play All flag in the root menu. There are many ways to do so, let's consider a straightforward one. Alongside the root menu, add as many empty PGCs as you have buttons on the menu. Set each button command to link to a different PGC so it would look like this:
LinkPGCN PGC_2
LinkPGCN PGC_3
...

Add two Pre commands for each new PGC according to the button they linked to. For Select Clip 1, it would be:
1. Mov GPRM0, 0
2. JumpVTS_TT Title_1
For clip 2, change title to Title_2 etc.

And finally, for Play All:
1. Mov GPRM0, 1
2. JumpVTS_TT Title_1

Therefore, for each Select Clip button clip you set the flag GPRM0=0 and for Play All GPRM0=1. In the Post commands of each title, it checks the flag and decides whether to return to the menu or play next clip.

Good luck.

[Jeff D]

Thanks dimmer that looks pretty simple and straight forward. I'll take your examples and give it a shot. Thanks!

[SomeJoe]

You don't have to use scripting to achieve this.

You can make separate titles within one VTS. In each title, define a single PGC, and add the scenes that you want to play contiguously as either programs (which creates chapters) or cells (which doesn't) to the PGC. Obviously, one of the PGCs (probably the one in the first title) will have all the scenes (i.e. the whole track) added to it, thus this is the "Play All" PGC. The other PGCs in the other titles will have only selected scenes.

In your main menu, just link the buttons to the appropriate PGC.

This will allw you to form whatever sequences of video you want in each PGC, Rew and FF won't take you to chapters/scenes that don't exist in that PGC, the DVD player's time display will display an accurate time for each PGC, video will not be duplicated on the disc, and no scripting is involved.

The only drawback is if you add scenes to a PGC that are not actually contiguous in the original track. In this case, the scenes will play in the proper order, but will not play seamlessly - there will be a short pause at the scene junction point. Nothing you can do about that - it's a limitation of Scenarist.

[Jeff D]

Originally posted by SomeJoe
The only drawback is if you add scenes to a PGC that are not actually contiguous in the original track. In this case, the scenes will play in the proper order, but will not play seamlessly - there will be a short pause at the scene junction point. Nothing you can do about that - it's a limitation of Scenarist.

I take it the two scenes are linked with a post command? And then does your method and the script method both have the same pause issue?

The last thing I forgot was the play in the order of the LD, this has the clips interleved, video then a few film clips, then more video then more film. So it would be jumpping between the two sources. (This may be more work than it's worth, but I'm in the discovery mode.) Thanks for the info!

[Dimmer]

@SomeJoe
The method you described will work just fine, but when you select Play All you'll be able to Rew/FF through all the clips, not just a currently playing one. As I understand, the original poster doesn't want this for some reason. Actually, I don't like this myself too, because I have to switch timer display from title to chapter in order to see the time within the current clip.

@Jeff D
In Scenarist, two cells/scenes that are not physically adjacent on the disc will always have a pause between them. You can easily verify this for any cell: if you can't change NSM (Non-Seamless) flag to SM (Seamless) in properties window, that means there will be a pause in the beginning. Apparently, at this time there is no software for Windows that can get around this issue.

As for your source, I'm pretty sure Scenarist won't allow you to put incompatible tracks in the same titleset, so as long as you don't get any errors, it'll work fine. Otherwise you'll have to split the project in two VTS.

[Jeff D]

Originally posted by dimmer
As for your source, I'm pretty sure Scenarist won't allow you to put incompatible tracks in the same titleset, so as long as you don't get any errors, it'll work fine. Otherwise you'll have to split the project in two VTS.

dimmer
I don't think the two clips are incompatible. The are both of the same size, AR, etc. The only differences is one is 24fps source set to 29.97 with drop frames flags set to true and the RFF and TFF flags set for the 3:2 pulldown. As far as I know those would be compatible... but I've been wrong before.

Reading through the commands docs is interesting. Do you have a good reference for the DVD nav commands? I think that might be worth looking at.

[Dimmer]

It might not be a best idea to mix 24fps and 29.97fps within the same titleset because this could result in an out-of-standard DVD. By the way, NTSC film framerate allowed by DVD is 23.997fps. But again, if you are only going to watch this at home, then try to author it anyway and burn it onto RW. As long as it works on your standalone player, you're set.

Here's a good site with full list of DVD commands as well as detailed description of DVD structure:

http://www.dvd-replica.com/DVD/vmcommands.php

It also has on-the-fly command code generator if you ever need to fix an IFO file in IfoEdit.

[SomeJoe]

@dimmer

Jeff said that when the viewer plays single clips i.e. by selecting that clip from the menu, he doesn't want the user to be able to FF or Rew to other clips. He didn't say anything about not allowing the user to FF or Rew to other clips when viewing the entire presentation using the Play All selection.

@JeffD

No, the scenes are not linked with any sort of command. Scenarist will play them in the sequence defined in the PGC.

And to answer your other question, which dimmer also answered, yes if you play two things on the disc via any method where the two things are not physically adjacent and contiguous in the original track, the playback will be non-seamless.

As dimmer said, there may be a problem with interleaving MPEG-2 with the different playback flags/rates. However, in the end, the resulting video is all 29.97fps. I doubt that many players will have too much problem with it. If it becomes a problem, you might try reencoding your MPEG-2 with the "close all GOPs" option selected.

I'll illustrate an example here to show what you can do:

Suppose I have a medical training video. It's all one .m2v and .ac3, and it consists of 3 surgeries filmed in the operating room. Each surgery has 4 parts: Anaesthesia, open, procedure, and close. In the "Play All" selection from the main menu, I want all 3 surgeries shown in order, in 3 chapters, one for each surgery. In the individual surgery selections, I want each surgery to play on it's own, with 4 chapters - one for each part of that surgery.

Here's how you set it up:

In the track editor, put the .m2v & .ac3 on the track. Now define 12 scenes, one for each of the 4 parts of the 3 surgeries.

In the scenario editor, make 1 VTS, and 4 titles within that VTS. The first title will be our "Play All" title, the other 3 will be the individual surgery titles. We'll construct the individual surgeries first.

In title 2 we're going to make the sugery #1 selection: make a PGC by dragging the first scene of surgery #1 to the title folder. This makes a PGC, program, and cell of the scene. Add the other 3 scenes from surgery #1 by dragging the scenes onto the PGC, in order. This makes another program and cell for each scene. You now have surgery #1 in 4 chapters.

Repeat that procedure for surgery #2 and surgery #3 in title 3 and title 4, respectively.

Now to make the "Play All" selection. Drag scene 1 from surgery #1 onto the title 1 folder. This makes a PGC, program, and cell. Now, we want the other scenes from surgery #1 to follow, but we don't want a new chapter until we get to surgery #2. So drag scenes #2, #3, and #4 from surgery 1 onto the program, not the PGC. This creates a new cell only. Thus the scenes playback in order, but the chapter number stays as chapter 1. Now to begin a new chapter for surgery #2, drag scene #1 from surgery #2 onto the PGC, which creates a new program (chapter), and cell. Repeat this procedure to get all scenes into the play all PGC. You'll end up with the PGC, 3 programs, and 4 cells per program for a total of 12 cells.

Now just make your menu PGC in the VMG, and link the buttons to the correct PGCs in the titles. Link each PGC in the titles back to the main menu.

As a bonus, suppose you want to show surgery #3 for advanced residents who don't need to see the open & close parts of the surgery. They only need the anaesthesia & procedure portions, and only 1 chapter:

Make title 5 within the VTS, & drag scene #1 from surgery #3 to the title folder: You get a PGC, program, & cell. Drag scene #3 (the procedure) to the program. You now have a PGC that plays only the anaesthesia & procedure, no open & close. However, notice that the cell is flagged as NSM (non-seamless). This is unavoidable because the procedure scene is not contiguous with the anaesthesia scene in the original track -- the open scene of the surgery is in-between.


Your setup will be similar, except you'll be dragging scenes from two different tracks (one interlaced & one progressive). Again, any two cells that aren't contiguous in the original track will be non-seamless.

[Jeff D]

Ok, I've got some experimenting to do.

Thanks to both you guys for the ideas to work with.
Sorry for not being specific on the 24fps as 23.997... This stuff I understand very well.

Settings on the progressive stream:
29.97, drop frames true, progressive image

SomeJoe, thanks for the "close" GOPs comments, I'm going to be reencoding the two streams marking some chapters, which wasn't done the first time, I'll be sure to close GOPs.

I currenlty have to two titles one for interlaced and one for progressive. The addition of more titles sounds very interesting, I never thought of adding more titles.