PGC 1 and 2 are identical

[Walmarde]

Hi, I'm wondering what am I suppossed to do with the two towers extended version if in the first vob set, the two PGC are the same(exactly the same) and they both use vob_id 1 and 2.

Wich one should i use in doitfast4u and should I demux by vob_id?

[HyperYagami]

read the docs, read the guides and read the forums.

[Walmarde]

like I didn't?

[Matthew]

Treat it just as if there was only 1 PGC, except at the end in scenarist create an additional title/PGC containing the same content as the first title/PGC. Should take under a min.

[HyperYagami]

Originally posted by Walmarde
like I didn't?

yes you REALLY didn't.

http://www.doom9.org/mpg/ra-guide.htm

[Walmarde]

I used this guide to backup http://www.doom9.org/mpg/ra-guide.htm , I read it like four time, I know I'm a newby but don't shit on me and don't try to do the job of the moderator... and thanks Matthew for your help.

[HyperYagami]

Originally posted by Walmarde
I read it like four time

"Also check Autodetect and Uncheck Duplicate PGCs so that in case of duplicate VOB IDs in multiple PGCs, those are not extracted and processed multiple times."

there are bunch of forum msgs too if you bothered to search.

[69Mws]

I think the two PGCs are because of the commentaries. They are part of the second PGC and the commentaries maybe have different duration compared to the regular audio-tracks. Extended version of "Fellowship Of The Ring" was the same, if I'm not mistaken.

I think it should also work, when you demux PGC2, delete then the dummy for PGC1 in the scenario editor created by ReAuthorist and set "Adjusted Cell Mode" in IfoUpdate when updating that ifo. That way PGC1 should be recreated in the update process.

Greetz
69Mws

[dazzle]

Originally posted by Matthew
Treat it just as if there was only 1 PGC, except at the end in scenarist create an additional title/PGC containing the same content as the first title/PGC. Should take under a min.

I'm just about to do one of these in Scenarist, and have a quick question about how to do it using the method in the quote above:

In Scenarist, should I go to the Scenario-Tab and delete the dummies in PGC1 and 3 (DIF4U checked 2 & 4).

Then just copy everything under PGC2 (and later also PGC4) and paste the content in PGC1 (and later on also PGC3).

Then do the rest as usual.

Have I understood this procedure correctly?

[Trahald]

proceed as usual. then just use scenaid to make your scenarist script. it can handle multi pgcs like that fine. just reimport subs in scenarist to make sure they are ok

[dazzle]

Aha, so I can make a script with SceneAid after encoding instead of R.A.
I must try that :)

Hey, cool program. I generated a new script with SceneAid, and now I'm doing a new and fresh session in Scenarist :)

So now I can just proceed as usual, no mumbo jumbo in Scenarist or Hocus Pocus in Ifo Update?

[Trahald]

yep.. well i should say.. with the last version of scenaid. there were some issues with subs.. check your import log and make sure there were no errors. if there werent.. compile and ifoupdate as usuall. if there were any failed to paste, you can just delete and reimport the subs. the issue seems fixed in scenaid 0906 but that version is being finalized.

for now i actually turn off the sub option for scenaid and always manually import them.. doesnt take much longer than when the script imports the subs.

[dazzle]

I got a few of these:

Warning Sub-Picture (stream 22 in Track "VTS01P02") is across scene boundary at 00:29:30;06
Warning Sub-Picture (stream 23 in Track "VTS01P02") is across scene boundary at 00:29:30;06
Warning Sub-Picture (stream 24 in Track "VTS01P02") is across scene boundary at 00:29:30;06

But otherwise the subs seem fine.
And the duplicate PGC:s are correctly set, I love these programs :D

At a closer look, I got some of these as well:
Error Class(Video) Tag(Size, 1522540772) failed to paste

So I guess I should re-import the subs?

[Trahald]

At a closer look, I got some of these as well:
Error Class(Video) Tag(Size, 1522540772) failed to paste

So I guess I should re-import the subs?

well.. i think it just kills a few subs.. since its hard to see the error , i actually completed projects with the error. didnt notice anything wrong with subs at playback.. but i might not have been looking close enough.. basic answer is.. yes.. reimport .... reimporting the subs is way easier then redoing the scenario layout

[dazzle]

Ok, will do.

Hmm, it seems that SceneAid didn't import the dummy audio tracks that was previously created..?

[Trahald]

any audio/sub tracks you marked as dummy in dif4u, scenaid will make its own dummies for.. any audio/sub tracks you marked in reauthorist as dummy you will have to manually fix the tracks in scenarist when using a scenaid script. check out the older scenarist guides for info how to do so. i do all my unselecting of audio/subs with dif4u. i rarely use ra (sometimes bitrate is too low so must deselect an additional audio) then i just add the dummy reathorist made manually after i import my scenaid script

[dazzle]

I see.
I'm pretty sure I made them in DIF4U (I'm getting a little confused now). They're named: VTS__01_P02-81-ch2English.dummy.AC3

SceneAid created some dummies, 1 is called : FILL-2ch-192kbps.AC3

But, Scenarist doesn't import it (it should be 2). And it's not in the script.

[EonBlue]

Like Trahald said, you'll have to manually fix the dummy tracks...but it's very easy to do. First you need to import the dummy audio since the ScenAid script didn't. To do this just click and drag the dummy ac3 into the data editor window. Then change the drop type to drop frame. Now go to the track editor and create the right number of audio streams...then just drag the dummy ac3 into its appropriate stream number and compile as usual from there.

PS: I'm not at my computer right now so the instructions may be a bit vague. If you still don't know how to insert the dummy ac3s, then I'll try and be more specific whenever I get back home and actually have a copy of scenarist at hand.

[dazzle]

Thanks!
I think I got it, will try it first thing tomorrow :)

[dazzle]

I followed your advice, it encodes all the subs but then it refuses to make the vob files:


Error dvd_mux : Open Mux_list File Error
Error Terminated Multiplexing (movietitle.scn-VTS01P02_t.vob).
Error Wrong mux_list. Mux_list format or stream ID may be wrong.
Error Multiplex is failed.
Info Multiplexing failed, Track<VTS01P02>

Error MuxFromDB:MuxVTS failed
Error Multiplex failed
Error DVD files could not be created



Could it be that the audio streams I imported was named differently? Anyways, I tried to rename them so they look like the audio that ar still left. I'm trying once again :)

[dazzle]

No, I still got the same error :(
Does anybody have a clue?

[jel]

Error dvd_mux : Open Mux_list File Error
Error Terminated Multiplexing (movietitle.scn-VTS01P02_t.vob).
Error Wrong mux_list. Mux_list format or stream ID may be wrong.
Error Multiplex is failed.
Info Multiplexing failed, Track<VTS01P02>
Error MuxFromDB:MuxVTS failed
Error Multiplex failed
Error DVD files could not be created

hi dazzle,
are there any other warnings/errors that appear in the build window prior to this error message? as unfortunately this doesnt tell us much, except that track VTS_01_P02 has some issues somewhere.
cheers
j

[dazzle]

Hi Jel.
I gave up and used dvd2dvdr on this one instead. :(
I know...I'm a traitor, a quitter and a whimp...:D

Of course I had to rip things out and the structure became a mess, but I fixed the most of it with MenuEdit and IfoEdit.

I just became very, very tired...since my last two movies has been very messy :P

Thanks for all you guys help though!

[jel]

hmmm...using dvd2dvdr may be grounds for a good ol' public flogging.... but i am sure you could plead temporary insanity :D
anyway, if you feel like trying again, i would be more than happy to work through it with you, and it may be beneficial to other forum members.
take care
j

[EonBlue]

If you really wanna get into the Big3, then you have to start somewhere right? :D With people like jel at your disposal, you really should give it another go (I've done TTT - EE and I'd be glad to help you as well). I remember working for weeks on a BoV project and felt scrapping it all together and DVDShrinking it...but influenza was extremely patient and helpful and got me through it (this was way back when before he wasn't even a moderator ;) ). I'm still an idiot when it comes the Big3 but I'm learning more and more each day and that's only by working through the difficult projects. Once you get past your first really 'tough' backup, you'll actually feel disappointed whenever you come across an ol' DVD5 :D

[dazzle]

Where am I...what happened..I can't remember anything for the last couple of days... :D

First off: Big Thanks to Jel, EonBlue and Trahald!
I don't feel alone anymore :D

anyway, if you feel like trying again, i would be more than happy to work through it with you, and it may be beneficial to other forum members.

Yes, maybe we should do that for educational use (and for future recerence, and as you said beneficial to other forum members.).
I don't mind encoding it again (machoist is my middle name ;)).

The thing is, I thought I was pretty hot with the big 3 by now...until I realised my two latest ones were different and more difficult. But that's half the fun right? :D

So if we should do this by the book, maybe we should take it step by step?
----------
Step 1. DoItFast4U
I have the program set up as usual(as in the guide (http://www.doom9.org/mpg/ra-guide.htm)).

The movie is PAL, and contains 4 audio tracks (I want to keep 2; Eng DD5.1 and Commentary). There are also A LOT of subs (both for the film and for the commentary) which I want to keep.

The film has 4 Vts-sets and only 1 needs decoding (VTS01).

Vts01 contains 4 pgc:s: No 1 and 2 are identical (the movie). No 3 and 4 are identical, but are very small.

DIF4U automatically checks No 2 and 4, leaving the rest unchecked.
Rest of the settings are like in the guide, except i've checked the "Frame Diagnos" in Other Options.

So...:)

[jel]

So... Do It! :D

ps check your pm dazzle

[dazzle]

Ok, done :)

Step 2: ReAuthorist and DoCCE as usual.

So now it's time for ReAuthorist or ScenAid...which ever you prefer :D

[jel]

okay, well for those following this, the .ifo seems to be a typical scenario whereby the second pgc is simply a 'directors/actors commentary'
so what you would have is :
pgc_1 - standard movie played with your choice of audio/sub-pictures
pgc_2 - movie with directors/actors commentaries

now because pgc_2 will contain the same 'over-alll' data as pgc_1, dif4U deselects the 're-used' pgc from what is required, but offers the warning of "manual use of scenarist required" - meaning that following re-encoding we may need to work some mo-jo in Scenarist, to get everything working the way it should.

but this does not effect the 'encoding' process, so set your variables to suit your intended output' in DoCCE4U/BatchCCE and press 'play', them sit back while it encodes for several hours.....

[dazzle]

Alrighty, encoding is finished. It's time for the...mojo :D

[jel]

alrighty then ....mojo time!

okay, well at time of discussion we have two choices for generating a script for us:
Scenaid 0.9.0.5 or
Re-Authorist 1.0.0
now, no offense to either of the authors of these fantastic apps, but each has its own quirks.
so if you use ReAuthorist you will have to manually add the layout for pgc_1 and pgc_3 in the Scenario Editor.
Now Scenaid can take this extra step out of the equation for us, however it *may* intoduce a new problem of subtitles.

so lets choose Scenaid! create your script, choosing NOT to imoprt subtitles in the 'options' menu. -

options , Enable SubTitle Import and deselect this option.

import into Scenarist

[jel]

option 1: ReAuthorist
once you have imported the script, open up the 'scenario editor'. you will notice that as only pgc_2 and pgc_4 were selected by DoItFast4U for demux, RA will create a 'dummy' track for pgc_1 and pgc_3.
so using the .ifo and the other pgc's as a map/guide it is an easy process to recreate the 'dummied' pgcs.
step 1: delete the 'dummy' cells/programs for the scenario.
step 2: from the 'asset window' (bottom right hand side window), select the 'tracks' tab, and expand the folder (using the '+' button) to view the tracks, then expand the folder for pgc_2.
step 3: from the 'asset window', drag and drop the tracks, in correct order, to pgc_1. note: if you drop a track onto the pgc, you will create a chapter, if you drag and drop a track onto a program, you will create a cell.
repeat until you have pgc_1 looking like pgc_2 .please note that quite often the structure of the pgcs will be different (in regards to chapters/cells), so it is recommended that you follow the layout from ifoedit, rather than blindly copy the other pgc.
step 4: repeat steps 1~3 for pgc_3 (although in this case it may not be necessary as it is simply a 'dummy' track anyway)

option 2: Scenaid
importing subtitles!

step 1:in the 'track editor' window, select the track you wish to add subtitles to and double click on it to show the video/audio streams.
step 2: create the number of subtitle streams you require (in your case dazzle, if you have kept all subtitles you will need to create 13 substreams).
New , SubPicture Stream or select the funny looking 'pink square' from the tool bar.
step 3: select 'import subtitles' either from the toolbar (blue square with the arrow) or Tools Import Subtitle and you will get a new window pop-up.
starting with 'stream 1' navigate the file path to your first substream. this will be located in the demux folder, under vts_01 (in this case), in the subs folder. your first substream folder will have a title such as 'VTS_01_VSUB_P1A1-00', open this and you will find a 'VTS_01_VSUB_P1A1-00-English.sst' file, select this and press ok.
now two things to note here:
substream '00' correlates to 'Substream 1' in scenarist, and:
if you see an sst file in your folder titled 'VTS_01_VSUB_P1A1-00-English-forced.sst' do not select this - we will deal with forced subs in sec.
so repeat for the other substreams -remember to make sure you change your streams in the 'subtitle import' window with each new sst fie you navigate to - select the 'circle' next to the number before you select 'file path'.
once you've finished press 'start' . you will get a warning telling you it will take a while ...
step 4: forced subtitles.
once you have imported you subtitles, check to see if you have any forced subtitles. if so, create another substream and 'import' your forced substream. using this as a guide you then need to change the appropriate subpictures in the relevant stream to 'forced'.
this is done by highlighting the stream, and in the 'property browser' (bottom middle window), double click on the 'data' folder, and select the 'forced start' option.
repeat as necessary.

compile and test.

hope that made sense

[dazzle]

Yes, you have written it very understandable. Thanks :)
I'll start with ScenAid and then do the ReAuthorist.

One question though: It seems like SceneAid didn't import the dummy audio again. Or rather, the audio tracks are there and correct in the Track Editor, but there are no dummy files in the Data Editor.

Should I just add the dummy files (drag them to the Data Editor) and make new tracks in the Track Editor?

...and by the way there are 13 subs x 2, since they are W and L. I really start regretting keeping all of them...:D

[dazzle]

ScenAid
Hmm...when I tried to import the subs one by one (as described above) I got this error message from subttitle stream #7 and forward:

---------
Info Checking Subtitle File. Stream ID = 13, File = (F:\SEAB_EXTRA\VTS01\subs\VTS_01_VSUB_P2A1-12\VTS_01_VSUB_P2A1-12-English.sst)
Error Timecode is overlapping at this sub-picture. [00:20:08;05 - 00:20:10;23]
Error Timecode is overlapping at this sub-picture. [00:28:02;22 - 00:28:05;19]
Info
---------

I then tried to import all subs at once (selecting them all in Subtitle Import, without creating the subtitle tracks first). Scenarist then seemed to import all subs (they all seem to be there), but with the same error message as above from sub stream #7 and forward.



--

Ok, I noticed some errors that I had missed:

1. I had to delete the audio streams, since for some reason the dummy audio tracks in the Track Editor was there but they didn't contain any files (no dummies in Data Editor). I made new audio tracks (in the right order), and included the dummy files made by DIF4U.

2. Since my subtitles was ripped as doubles (W and L), I checked the sub streams in Scenarist as such (W for no 1, L for no 2 and so on). Before they were all checked as W.

After these fixes Scenarist compiled it correctly, but when I checked the movie in WinDVD subs were only available in the first 1/3:rd of the movie :(

[dazzle]

ReAuthorist
I followed your steps as above, and re-created PGC01 as it was structured in VTS_01_0.IFO (some cells shared a program and so on). I did the same with PGC03.

Unfortunatly I got an error code when I tried to compile:

Error The Subpicture Attribute(Language and so on) For Wide in PGC<VTS_01_PGC_02pgc>:Stream<25>:Title<VTS01_Title02> is different from The Reference PGC<VTS_01_PGC_01pgc>
Error The Subpicture Attribute(Language and so on) For Letter Box in PGC<VTS_01_PGC_02pgc>:Stream<25>:Title<VTS01_Title02> is different from The Reference PGC<VTS_01_PGC_01pgc>
Error PreCheck From DB failed
Error DVD files could not be created


I've send you some screenshots on it as well.

[jel]

wow! you have been busy.
okay, well where to start.

basically from the screenshots you sent me and the warnings posted, i can without hesitation say that your subs were not extracted properly.
the fact that they quit 1/3rd of the way through the movie and that they start at approx. subpic number 770 suggests that for the first part of the movie, the subs were not ripped.

what version of DoItFast4U are you using?

anyways, as a fix i would recommend you get yourself a copy of 'SubRip_1.17.1' avaliable from the doom9 download section. there is also a guide on how to use it here:
Subtitle Guide (http://www.doom9.org/index.html?/subtitle_guide.htm)
please note that you will have to adjust the colours/contrast on these subs after you have imported them into scenarist.
if you check out the guide i wrote on BOV (see sticky thread) it details how to do this.

i would try this with your first substream to see if you get the hang of it and that it actually solves your problems.
Error The Subpicture Attribute(Language and so on) For Wide in PGC<VTS_01_PGC_02pgc>:Stream<25>:Title<VTS01_Title02> is different from The Reference PGC<VTS_01_PGC_01pgc>
Error The Subpicture Attribute(Language and so on) For Letter Box in PGC<VTS_01_PGC_02pgc>:Stream<25>:Title<VTS01_Title02> is different from The Reference PGC<VTS_01_PGC_01pgc>
Error PreCheck From DB failed
okay well this is very easy to fix: quoting myself from an earlier thread:
now before we finish with the scenario editor, select the PGC for VTS_01_PGC_01 and look in your property browser (bottom/middle window) and select the 'Sub-Pic Attributes' and make sure that each stream is set to match what is listed in VTS_01_PGC_02 (see this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=63862), answered by Leon).

let me know how you go.

and good luck!

[dazzle]

Thanks for all your help jel!
Because of this, I know my way around Scenarist 500% more than before. :)
And now I know how to solve a problem like this in BOTH ScenAid and in ReAuthorist. :)
And I think both ways were pretty easy (once you get them explained to you that is).

For everybody else with duplicate pgc:s you can just follow jels steps above, and you should be all set! :)

I use DIF4U 1.40.

I'll try to rip the subs again with SubRip later on today. I think something happened this time around, cause last time I ripped this movie they were all correct (I got it to compile last time, but it didn't work properly).

[jel]

no worries chief, glad to be of service.

you can always try re-running DIF4U in a seperate folder and then check to see if the subs are all there, otherwise you may have to use subrip to extract them all manually.

for the record, with the latest versions of DIF4U, subripping is now 100 times faster and to date, i have not received any errors in regards to subs.

if you have any other issues let me know

rock on

j

[dazzle]

you can always try re-running DIF4U in a seperate folder and then check to see if the subs are all there, otherwise you may have to use subrip to extract them all manually.

Yepp, that was my plan. I'll try it when I get home. :)

for the record, with the latest versions of DIF4U, subripping is now 100 times faster and to date, i have not received any errors in regards to subs.

Aha, sounds good. But that's not available for downloading yet...right?


if you have any other issues let me know
Hehe...well actually I have this other problem-movie...:D
You might get a suspect PM after I get this one right. :)