DV Help

[pug306d]

I recently brought a Samsung Mini DV Camcorder (VP-D34i) and am having some problems putting the video on to DVD. My finished movie never looks as good as it does on the camera preview. This picture shows a capture of my finished DVD

:: image removed ::

The whole video on moving shots seems to have a "ghosting" effect, are there any filters etc that can remove this? What is causing it? I've captured the video using Adobe Premiere Pro 7 and tried converting it with CCE and TMPGEnc both give the same results. The captured AVI file looks the same although not as bad as the interlaced lines make it less obvious, the video played back on my TV direct from the DV tape on the camcorder does not have this?

Thanks for you help

[bb]

Looks like you deinterlaced the video using blending. Why don't you leave the video interlaced?

bb

[pug306d]

Hi thanks for the response, I've just been reading all about interlacing on 100fps.com and as far as I can tell I'm not deinterlacing?

In TMPG I select Interlaced on both the source and destination movie types but get the result as above. In CCE there is no setting?

I have been selecting the AVI directly or using

AviSource("C:\Untitled Clip 02.avi")

In a avisynth script, the interlaced script in the DV to DVD guide which is sticky in the DV forum gives me a error saying it only works with YUY2?

Thanks

[pug306d]

I've just tried a few different settings and some strange things happened.

TMPGEnc - CBR instead of 2pass VBR and the picture is ok?
CCE - CBR instead of VBR + Selecting Upper Field first gives better result?

As mentioned before I was following the guide DV to DVD thats sticky in this forum which is why I was using VBR and not selecting Upper field first. Any idea's why this would be different for my setup?

I've also noticed playing the DVD back in WMP9 instead of PowerDVD 5.0 gives a better result???

[pug306d]

If I dont select Upper Field first then the picture is very jumpy if with enable Hardware Acceleration in power DVD off with it on the picture is fine?

I dont understand why all this is happening! Could you offer a explaination and the best way to get my DV to DVD?

Thanks

[StinkiePhish]

You are not the only one that is confused with all this interlacing mumbo jumbo. I just went through all this trying to get VHS to DVD using a Canopus ADVC-50 DV converter. I will fully admit that I am still completely a newbie when it comes to this.

I use CCE, but the concepts are the same. When you leave the source interlaced (as you should) and do Upper Field First (as you should), you are left with an interlaced output. I mux this .mpv with DVD Maestro after converting my audio to AC3.

Now, here is where you are at I assume. You preview the DVD in Power DVD. If you turn on hardware acceleration as you say, I am willing to bet that it is on-the-fly deinterlacing it. If you turn it off, you are watching your interlaced file on your progressive monitor, so it looks jerky.

Bottom line, the only way I could fully test whether I had a good interlaced output was burning it onto a DVD-R and watching it on TV. The TV is where it should look non-jerky and perfect again. Don't trust your monitor or software DVD players.

[pug306d]

Thanks StinkiePhish, this is the first time I've come to do this with my DV camcorder - I started at about 1pm today its now 1:15am in the morning and I'm getting there slowly!

I've converted DVD to Divx, Divx to DVD, DVD to VCD etc in the past and got on ok but with this DV camera I just dont seem to be able to get the picture perfect.

You are right PowerDVD is deinterlacing it on the fly and with the hardware acceleration enabled it looks ok(ish) Again I think your right about the only way I'll really know is if I burn to a DVD and try it. Unfortuntley my Pioneer 105 blew up a week before xmas and I'm waiting for it to be replaced under the warranty still, should be back with me any day now.

bed for me now anyway and I'll continue tomorrow!

Thanks for the help.

[bb]

If you watch an interlaced source on a progressive device (e.g. a computer monitor), you'll either see interlace lines or the software deinterlaces on the fly, which produces blending or interpolation artefacts.

If you don't have a DVD burner yet, you may be able to connect your TV set to your computer via TV out. You should see a good quality output then. If your film is jumpy, change the field order.

bb

[pug306d]

thanks bb, I tried it on my TV out but I still think the PC software is interfering with it somehow, it showed the interlaced lines on my TFT Monitor and not on the TV but when I paused the clip it still had a big ghost like the picture above.

My DVD burner should be back this week so I'll try it some more then and post how I get on.

Pug.

[malum]

That looks like the wrong field order.

DV is bottom field first.

CCE doesn't do bottom field first AFAIK, you'd have to convert if afterwards

[wongck5]

@pug306d
I would like to share my experience as I encountered exactly the same problems as yours before.

Previously, I tried to use Premier for video editing and frameserve to TMPG for encoding. As far as I could remember, TMPG detected the frameserved file to be progressive rather than interlaced material (I'm sure that deinterlace option in premier was turned off). Even though I force it to interlaced source and interlaced encoding in TMPG, the final mpeg2 stream is never to be truly interlaced (just like what you experienced with different DVD player). I guess this may be the problem with the frameserve plugin (?may be the version I used at that time is not updated) and the frameserve plugin could not handle interlaced video properly. Later I used LSX mpeg encoder plugin for Premier (Premier 6.0 had no built-in mpeg2 encoder), I could finally produce true interlaced mpeg-2 stream (that means, when you play the video by most software with deinterlace option turned off, it should have interlaced lines and smooth playback but not jerky or jumpy, just like what you see when playing your captured dv.avi). So I suggest you try to encode a short video using the Premier built-in encoder, you should be able to get a trouble free mpeg2 stream. I also noticed some commercial video editing software are not capable of producing interlaced mpeg2 video with their built-in mpeg2 encoder.

Please try to make sure that your edited dv.avi is also interlaced before encoding with TMPG.

[wongck5]

Just add one more point, window media player may do on-the-fly deinterlace during playback of dv.avi files and therefore ghosting effect is still visible.
Personally I use zoomplayer with deinterlace option turned off when trying to see if a video is interlaced or not.

Please correct me if something wrong as I'm still a newbie.

[pug306d]

@wongck5 - When I started this I had never used premier before and over the last few weeks have got to know my way around it. I figured out that I could export to DVD or MPEG2 from within premier and it worked fine this way just as you had suggested.

Previously I was capturing with Premier and then using avisynth to encode using CCE or TMPGEnc, techniques I've used to convert from Divx to DVD in the past and worked fine. The problem with my DV camera is that its interlaced and somewhere like wongck5 suggested I think something did not like the fact it was interlaced.

I've exported my video to a MPEG2 file using Adobe media encoder part of premier and the results are fine. The player you use to playback on the PC seriously affects how good it looks also, PowerDVD always uses a de-interlacer and cannot be de-activated from what I could see WMP play the exported M2v file with the interlaced lines on my computer just as it should!

Thanks everyone for your help.

[wongck5]

@pug306d
Your really need to burn the video to DVD and watch it on TV to have the best quality.
I used to watch my DVD with PowerDVD XP on my 42" LCD rear projector TV. From my experience, there is a big difference between interlaced and progressive scan video, at least with my LCD projector TV. Ghosting effect is very obvious if the DVD is encoded with progressive mode (use tomsmocomp filter in avisynth), just like what you've got. When playing interlaced DVD, I never see ghosting effect even though it is displayed on my progressive device. The quality is just a little bit worse than high bitrate Divx encoded in 50fps progressive.

Also you may try Divx 50fps (I use bitrate ~ 4000-5000) and the quality is the best I think. Of course the drawback is that it can't be played in standalone player.