Nero Recode2 (Nero Digital) released to press

[superdump]

According to JohnV here (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/show.php/showtopic/15985) Recode 2 betas have been released to testers and whatnot so we should get some articles soon. Check out the pretty screenshots in that thread. :)

[Tuning]

Thanks Superdump,

BTW, do you noticed the frame rate shown in screen shot. 98 fps!:eek: .

If it is on general PC (single processor), then Nero digital is going to take over all our current codecs. we have to wait until it is released to public.

Do anyone know what file type is output after encoding? (avi,mp4 ?)

Thanks.:)

[CruNcher]

yeah indeed it's nice and yes Tuning your fear is right it won't save .avi, but i personaly think that's good, because maybe if Recode 2 is very very sucessfull the demand for .Mp4 based Standalones will get higher and Consumer Electronic Vendors will also take it into their players including HE-AAC support that would be indeed great but somehow im not so sure that this will happen soon :(


BTW, do you noticed the frame rate shown in screen shot. 98 fps! .


if i remember correct he used a 3 Ghz Pc and only Simple Profile hmm

[Tuning]

@CruNcher

Sad to see its on a 3Ghz PC, on my PC just half speed, I think it will be approimately 50-60 fps. Then not bad. Wonder what fps can give in more complex profiles.

I have read in some other thread that HE-AAC decoding requires high processing power, so considering this, I think standalone implementation of HE-AAC decoding is not going to happen at the moment.

BTW, Bond will be happy on getting a mp4 creater software. ;) (I'm too :p )

[bond]

Originally posted by Tuning
Sad to see its on a 3Ghz PC, on my PC just half speed, I think it will be approimately 50-60 fps. Then not bad. Wonder what fps can give in more complex profiles.guys, plz calm down and stay realistic!
i am absolutely sure that it will not be faster than 25fps (decoding speed) when you use high quality features and you have to look what cpu is used too...
otherwise i will eat my shoes with sugar :D

BTW, Bond will be happy on getting a mp4 creater software. ;)well for me the BIG downside is that you cant use AVI input, which means that you also cant use Avisynth and its filters (which are imho necessary to get decent results for many (not all of course) movies on 1CD rips)

but i hope that ahead will also bring out a nice MP4 editing tool...

[tiki4]

... and I hope that Moritz Bunkus adds native MP4 'transmuxing' to Matroska container to his mkvmerge. So ChristianHJW finally gets his native MPEG4 streams.

tiki4

[JohnV]

I included some more codec info and few more pics to that article, so you may want to read it again. :)

[ChristianHJW]

Originally posted by tiki4 ... and I hope that Moritz Bunkus adds native MP4 'transmuxing' to Matroska container to his mkvmerge. So ChristianHJW finally gets his native MPEG4 streams. .. promised by Mosu for this weekend, maybe only from MP4 sources created with either NeroDigital or 3ivX MP4 muxer filter to start with, but he was requesting some test AVIs with b-frames from me also and mentioned that sysKin's MPEG4 frame reader code is quite easy to use ;) ...

Sorry for the OT ; tiki4 : please dont rape Nero or 3ivX threads for matroska topics in future ;) ...

[tiki4]

Originally posted by ChristianHJW

Sorry for the OT ; tiki4 : please dont rape Nero or 3ivX threads for matroska topics in future ;) ... [/B]

Sorry, then I mis-interpreted an MP4-thread as an MPEG4-thread. My fault, anyway very good news :)

I hope we can test next Recode in a while.

tiki4

[bond]

ok, some infos about Nero Digital/Recode2:

ND handles 1 b-frame
its GMC implementation has 3 warppoints (although once the usage of GMC and QPEL of ND wasnt recommended!?)

Nero Recode2 can only handle direct DVD input (no copy protected DVDs supported, to circumvent some of the protections used on DVDs you can additionally use this (http://www.afterdawn.com/software/video_software/dvd_tools/dvd43.cfm) (thanks to JohnV :) ))
also no AVI or VOB input (i really hope they change that in future versions or release other encoding apps too) :(

and yes it is said that it is pretty fast (even with high quality settings)
lets hope that we can get our hands on it soon, to be able to test it :)

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by bond
...no AVI or VOB input (i really hope they change that in future versions or release other encoding apps too) :( Bummer!

I wonder how NR2 will react with ghost/virtual DVD drives?

I must admit this information, together with the discovery that ALL DVD/Mpeg4 standalones players can't in fact spin MP4 container content has dented my opinion (and optimism) of the MP4 container!

So it looks like my Xcard is going to be with me for a good while yet!

Cheers

[everwicked]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Bummer!

I wonder how NR2 will react with ghost/virtual DVD drives?


It works just fine with daemon tools; you might want to have a look at my review, I mention it.

I would post the link but you know how it is.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by everwicked
It works just fine with daemon tools; you might want to have a look at my review, I mention it.

I would post the link but you know how it is. Thanks for that info. Very useful.

I have a few questions though,

How well does the 6Ch AAC audio function work and does it sound ok?

When generating 720x480/576 anamorphic Mpeg4 encodes from a DVD. Is AR flagging possible?

Has there been any indications as to the cost of the product?

And will it work independantly of Nero6, if you opt to save your encodes to your hard disk instead of burning directly to CD-R?

The info looks very good
Cheers

[Custom_VCD]

I work for a press..................
is it available to test yet and where?

[Doom9]

How well does the 6Ch AAC audio function work and does it sound ok?It uses the same encoder as already available in Nero6 so you can make up your own mind about that.

When generating 720x480/576 anamorphic Mpeg4 encodes from a DVD. Is AR flagging possible?I don't see any AR flags anywhere in the program.

Has there been any indications as to the cost of the product?No, but the package I got is an updated Nerovision package (Nero Pack2) so in all likelyness, the program will be free for owners of Nero6 (but there are OEM releases that do not include pack2.. so they will most likely have to pay extra).

And will it work independantly of Nero6, if you opt to save your encodes to your hard disk instead of burning directly to CD-R?No, pack2 is coupled to your Nero license. I think you get 30 days (but that's the same for the current Nerovision so you might want to verify that by yourself.. I have a Nero license and I couldn't do 30 days without it just to find this out). Bottom line is that Recode is part of the Nero package. Obviously you can burn MP4 files using any tool you want.

Last but not least, seem only to be supported in the Nero Media Player and the same goes for the chapters Recode2 generates.

Also, there is no mp4 splitting whatsoever, so you'll have to burn your 2 CD rip onto a DVD-R or find alternative means to split (I think the only way besides only using the simple profile, in which case you can use QT to split, is to demux the MP4, put it into MKV, split, demux and remux to MP4 but that way you loose chapters and subs). I think Recode is a good example why the MP4 container is not yet popular.. there are currently many drawbacks using it (oh yeah, standalones could play NeroDigital video but since none plays MP4 and AAC, you're SOL).

[SeeMoreDigital]

Thanks very much for the update Doom9. Much appreciated.

After following the various links posted on this web site and others and reading the information provided. I must admit I'm looking forward to the release of this product!

One, obvious draw back is it's inability to read/copy from encrypted DVD's. That said it would appear that this can be overcome fairly easily.

You comment about not being able to split the encode over 2No (or more) CD-R's is also upsetting. So maybe it might suit some people to encode the first and second half of a DVD separately (if that's possible). Not a perfect solution I know.

No AR flagging..... What a pisser..... Even WMV9 and the WMV container supports this. I don't know. I guess this means I'll have to bombard yet another company with emails about this feature!

And the MP4 container. Well it seems, as an Xcard user, I will be one of just a few people that will be able to view encodes stored in this container, via hardware!

As I've mentioned a few times before. I really thought every standalone could support this container already. So when you consider the MP4 market place is very small, it's really quite a bold step for Ahead (Nero) to come up with an encoding application such as this. Let's hope, if it becomes popular, all you guys with standalone players will be offered firmware upgrades.

Cheers

[Doom9]

So maybe it might suit some people to encode the first and second half of a DVD separately (if that's possible). Yes it is. You might want to check out my Recode2 guide, I'm talking about every option there is in the program wrt Nero Digital. As with DVD Shrink, you can set a start and end position, but you'll still have to make two projects as you cannot add two halves to the input list.. otherwise they'll be joined into one file.

One, obvious draw back is it's inability to read/copy from encrypted DVD's. That said it would appear that this can be overcome fairly easily.Every commercial product has that and that has never been a problem. There are in fact very few applications to include decryption for legal reason. My PC crashed when encoding from the DVD via AnyDVD but I suppose that was just a glitch (Nero and Recode don't like my brand new DVD burner.. they don't even list writing speed for CDs for it and want me to restrain my DVD burning speed to 2.4x) and the mounted ISO worked just fine as they all do.

Let's hope, if it becomes popular, all you guys with standalone players will be offered firmware upgrades.There's a problem with subs though which appear to not adhere to the standard.. so unless NeroDigital is specifically supported, forget your subs inside MP4 (and my first try with subtitles looked awful - the subs I mean - like the subs had been mutilated. I think something is wrong with the aliasing.. it looked almost like when you create a DVD and screw up the subtitle colors).

Personally, I think Ahead should let us use the codec outside of the Recode2 framework because currently MP4 is severaly limited both in the playback and editing area. OGM was only able to make an impact once the editing issue was resolved, and one of the main reasons Matroska is becoming quite popular is that it was tailored to be editable.. it's probably the most flexible of all the container formats out there, and as for standalone support, there seems to be a certain interest in player manufacturer circles.

and speed was mentioned here, I got about 50fps in idle mode when I was working on the recode2 guide, and somewhat above 40fps in the 2nd pass. Computer was the same used in the latest codec comparison so you'll find the full specs there. Note that those values are a rough approximation, performance will be better if the PC is encoding only and won't have to switch between different applications all the time. But what I heard, P4/Athlon 64 owners can expect a speed boost than to SSE2 optimizations. And obviously the source also matters.. this was PAL.. there's less data to be decoded for NTSC sources. I used b-frames, qpel and h.263 quantization and all the other options as shown in the guide.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by Doom9
Yes it is. You might want to check out my Recode2 guide, I'm talking about every option there is in the program wrt Nero Digital. As with DVD Shrink, you can set a start and end position, but you'll still have to make two projects as you cannot add two halves to the input list.. otherwise they'll be joined into one file. Blimey a guide already!

Originally posted by Doom9
Every commercial product has that and that has never been a problem. There are in fact very few applications to include decryption for legal reasons.... Nero and Recode don't like my brand new DVD burner.. Well you can't blame a guy for asking. And if Recode2 is half as good as expected, it's needed. It's not hard to imagine what would happen if Mpeg4/AAC movies on CD-R's started appearing all over the place. As for your new Liteon burner, problems have been reported with many, if not all, the new Liteon DVD drives. Sigma have even taken the unusual step of purchasing a drive after receiving complaints that the Xcard won't work with it!

Originally posted by Doom9
Personally, I think Ahead should let us use the codec outside of the Recode2 framework because currently MP4 is severaly limited both in the playback and editing area... it's probably the most flexible of all the container formats out there, and as for standalone support, there seems to be a certain interest in player manufacturer circles. Lets hope so!

Originally posted by Doom9
I got about 50fps in idle mode when I was working on the recode2 guide, and somewhat above 40fps in the 2nd pass.... Yes, the encoding speeds I've seen banded about are quite extraordinary!

Thanks again for the information update. Cheers

[Jaques]

Is there an ETA on this? I'm getting anxious with this AND VP6 both in limbo (not to mention HL2).

edit: \/ Sorry, it's been a tense year for nerds and I thought nero might have had a release date I hadn't seen. . . I guess Morrowind can have my soul back.

[Doom9]

Is there an ETA on this? Yes. When it's done ;) It's always the same.. all you can do is waste forum bandwidth but it won't make things move any faster.

[everwicked]

To answer a few questions..

As I described in my review IIRC, Recode is free for anyone that owns a Nero *6* licence. It is pretty much the same with their AAC encoder. You didn't have to pay extra to get it.

In fact, the official statement was:
Nero Recode 2 will be available for free for all Nero 6 retail users during December 2003.

An insider has also told it was going to be released sometime this week. It's Wednesday so..

Custom_VCD: It's not publicly available anywhere until it's released. To review the beta you'd have to contact Ahead themselves and ask.

[Jaques]

Originally posted by everwicked
An insider has also told it was going to be released sometime this week. It's Wednesday so..

Thanks.

[ookzDVD]

@Doom9 & Everwicked,

As you guys have already tested the Recode2 beta,
is that possible you post the program to us, not just the review :)

Thanks!

[zulu]

this question isn't meant to be serious, is it?

[Doom9]

I'll gladly post the part of the email that talks about not sharing the beta with anyone..

[everwicked]

Originally posted by ookzDVD
@Doom9 & Everwicked,

As you guys have already tested the Recode2 beta,
is that possible you post the program to us, not just the review :)

Thanks!

Tell you what. I'll split it into 10 RAR files and send you the 9 today.

Then, you can either try to 'guess' the 10th one or wait till its released when I will send it to you.

:devil:

[ookzDVD]

Sure, I was joking anyway. Sorry for that.

Is that true that the final Recode1 never released ?
I'm afraid that the Recode2 also never released again :(

@Doom9,
As your post on news today, do have any ideas when is the
perfect time to buy a new DVDRW ?
I saw on store couples weeks ago the TDK combo 4x is ~$100,
I think it's cheap.

Will the new 8x burner around ~$100 next year ?

Thanks.

[Doom9]

I got a LiteOn 8x burner 2 weeks ago, it was only $30 more expensive that the corresponding 4x drive (which is amongst the more affordable 4x burners as wel), so the prices are already reasonably low, but when all the major players have 8x drives in the marketplace (probably 2-3 months from now) I expect 8x burner prices to be not too far from today's 4x models (and of course we might have the price pressure from 12x drives that are supposed to be released in the first half of 2004, and dual layer burners).

[ThePanther]

Originally posted by everwicked
An insider has also told it was going to be released sometime this week. It's Wednesday so.Guess the insider was wrong........

[Doom9]

@ThePanther: Doesn't the week end at Sunday 23:59:59?

[ThePanther]

Do you really think it will be deliveried this week.

I don't think so, but I would seriously love to be proven wrong.

I can't wait to see how good it really is......

[everwicked]

Looks like I was right.

Have a look at the news :rolleyes:

[ThePanther]

A big man, is a man the can admit when he is wrong.

And boy, was I wrong.....

[SeeMoreDigital]

Well, what's all this then....

http://www.nero.com/en/nero-up.php

Cheers