impending 'longhorn' drm reason to port avisynth to *nix?

[fisix]

its not just DRM, but some other issues as well. i just wondered if anyone was starting to seriously consider porting avisynth to an open platform.. and i'm also wondering what anyone else is thinking about this. something worth worrying about? why or why not?

-fiz

[sh0dan]

A Linux port would be nice - whatever the reason, but it's a lot of work.

I don't use any *NiX-related OS's, and have no plans to do so. I guess if anyone is up for the task, they might just as well go ahead.

I do not see how DRM comes into this, though.

[Neo Neko]

Originally posted by sh0dan
A Linux port would be nice - whatever the reason, but it's a lot of work.

Especially for it to be portable. IIRC doesn't AVS rely on directshow for decoding most video formats?

Originally posted by sh0dan
I don't use any *NiX-related OS's, and have no plans to do so. I guess if anyone is up for the task, they might just as well go ahead.

I do not see how DRM comes into this, though.

Well with recent announcements about the DVD+R forum coming up with a copy protection encumbered update and the FCC etc voting over whether or not to implement digital flaging of publicly broadcast material the last thing one needs is the OS to fight against them more. The need for the average user to upgrade to longhorn is questionable. Even more questionable will be the necessity for business to do so. But what is not in question is that Microsoft "is" going to force as many as possible to upgrade. This is really starting to upset people so many that would never have before are looking to go outside the Windows world.

Having said that. With a little spit and polish gstreamer when fully opperational could act as a replacement for both Directshow and Avisynth. We just need to get it to that point IMO.

[trbarry]

Microsoft occasionally states that turning on things like Palladium, Trusted-PC, etc. will be optional.

I'm still taking a wait and see attitude. If that ever changes then it will certainly be time for me to learn Linux. But so far I still know little about it and try not to worry about it too much.

- Tom

[MfA]

Which wont really matter to most people if Office simply requires it to be turned on to run.

[fisix]

the question mainly comes from some statements that center around process signing and control. i guess i agree with the wait and see attitude. most of the issues might be worked around quite quickly. as an example, the encryption scheme initially developed to secure HD transport (mainly for HDDVD), called HDCP i think, has already been circumvented, though no-one actually uses it yet as far as i know. many new projectors with dvi input have the capability stamped on the case...

anyway, i have always wondered how speedy a dedicated linux distro could be for the type of video capture and processing we all do. i can eek out f'sps by turning off much of the helper services win2k loads, and i've always thought of linux as something that could be much more effeciently streamlined, but on the flip side i've never seen benchmarks on a (single) *nix box chewing through video, and i've never been as happy with nix video performance as i am with win2k.

it has to be possible, because from what i gather all the set top pvr boxes are nix based.

the one thing that pops up each time someone mentions avisynth and nix is the directshow issue. could someone explain this issue? is directshow the renderer, or a wraper to send the data to the video card drivers in an optimized way?

[Richard Berg]

http://www.microsoft.com/Developer/PRODINFO/directx/dxm/help/ds/default.htm

[d'Oursse]

could Gstreamer ( http://www.gstreamer.net/ ) not be the solution (even if the API is not fixed atm) ?

[stax76]

the other option to switching to a open source os would be to stay with a windows version before Longhorn, I'm planning to stay with XP for _many_ years. Maybe I'll change my mind since Longhorn will introduce a truckload of new features like radical changes how to deal with files and there location, a new graphic card accelerated user interface, a new powerful programming API (.NET 2.0 :devil: ), a new powerful commandline interface and many other new things. Unfortunately I would have to spend more money, would have to live with more big brother type features, more security holes, more legacy code, more bloat so probably I will never spend money for it and learn rather about Gnome/Mono, but this won't happen anytime soon

[mf]

I still have take-over-the-world kind of visions of how an opensource OS should ideally be, but I guess they'll stay at ideas. Windows has its acknowledged annoyances and so does unix. I could combine it all, if only I had the coding power.. :rolleyes: *dreams on* :D

[stax76]

I'm very happy about the fact all new API's in Longhorn will be managed _only_ (managed = .NET) and there will be many new powerful API's, XAML being my favorite. To tell it simple one of the worst API's (Win32) don't has to be used any longer because the best API (.NET framework) can be used instead. Also Novell lately purchased Ximian and is about to purchase Suse. It's seems they are pushing Mono development heavily and will include Mono in their distro. I think both of this is great news for all .NET developers

[bilu]

Originally posted by mf
I still have take-over-the-world kind of visions of how an opensource OS should ideally be, but I guess they'll stay at ideas. Windows has its acknowledged annoyances and so does unix. I could combine it all, if only I had the coding power.. :rolleyes: *dreams on* :D

Something between BeOS,QNX and OSX ? ;)


Bilu

[mf]

Originally posted by bilu
Something between BeOS,QNX and OSX ? ;)
No, something between Windoze and Linux ;).

[Piper]

I believe porting AVISynth to Linux is a worthwhile persuit, but while we're at it perhaps we could convince Avery to port VirtualDub as well. And what about TMPGEnc, or even some decent capture drivers for my ATI AIW?

I'd love to use Linux full time, and I would too if the above ports were available. I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but we've a long way to go and AVISynth is but one piece of the puzzle.

[d'Oursse]

avidemux is a virtualdub-like on linux.
transcode is not a frameserver but it can load plugin filters.

IMHO, a frameserver used with avidemux would be great :)

[bilu]

Portability, variable framerate, ability to export frames to different interfaces (VFW,DSHow, others) are motives to think about a new framework. This couldn't be done in Avisynth without complete rewrite.

I love Avisynth, don't get me wrong. But it's limitations are growing stronger on people's needs.

Note: This shouldn't be understood as bashing.

Bilu

[Bidoche]

Having avisynth under linux may not be that much work, it only depends on the OS from its connection with VFW.
(I am not saying I would do it)

[bilu]

@Bidoche

AVILib?

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=278284#post278284


Bilu

[stax76]

Having avisynth under linux may not be that much work, it only depends on the OS from its connection with VFW


I was thinking the assembly is the main problem?


I believe porting AVISynth to Linux is a worthwhile persuit, but while we're at it perhaps we could convince Avery to port VirtualDub as well. And what about TMPGEnc, or even some decent capture drivers for my ATI AIW?


without Wine it's hardly possible I think. Imho portable GUI programs should use wxWindows or #WT when it's finished

[Bidoche]

I was thinking the assembly is the main problem?Hum, seems I overlooked that point.
But I don't really know if this is an issue or not to have all this inline assembler feeded into a linux compiler...

[Kurosu]

gcc asm syntax is a pain in many parts of the body, but except writing naked-style functions, nasm provides an easy alternative. But anyway, even filters would have to be rewritten. I wonder what good it would do to first write the filtering environement, then check if it can be interface with anything. mencode or gstreamer are tools/APIs/... that are worth studying before doing anything.

[Neo Neko]

Originally posted by Piper
I believe porting AVISynth to Linux is a worthwhile persuit, but while we're at it perhaps we could convince Avery to port VirtualDub as well.

Avery has expressed a desire and wish to be able to port to linux. But he has said himself that he simply lacks the knowledge and that Virtualdub currently uses alot of inline assembly and VC++ specific code. So step 1 would be for someone to get it to a state that it could be compiled with GCC. You can run Virtualdub under Linux with Wine though not for capture.

[Piper]

Is anyone here capturing in Linux right now? I admit I haven't researched this in depth, but I don't know of any decent capture apps (AVI_IO equivalent) or even capture drivers for the ATI AIW.

[Neo Neko]

At this exact moment in time I am not capturing under Linux no. The only time I ever did was when I was testing the SuSe Live CD. WOW comes to mind. And why do people buy Windows. But that is for another day. Needless to say the OS lauched from the CD detected and set up all my hardware including capture card with no help on my part!

[sillKotscha]

Originally posted by Piper
but I don't know of any decent capture apps

I'm not capturing with linux but saw something like this for your convenience...

- for recording: Gv4I: http://gv4l.sourceforge.net/screenshots.html

- for editing: I don't now ;(

Edit for 'editing' ;).... have look at avidemux http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/ - I guess you somewhat know the look of the tool ;)

[Piper]

It looks as though capture/editing tools have developed since I last had a look, thanks for the links.

Perhaps if AVISynth is eventually ported to Linux, it may be worth another look.