Success : IfoEdit & TmpGEnc

[charker]

Finally managed to remux a TmpGEnc file with IFOEdit and the results are excellent.

Basically you need

SMARTRIPPER
DVD2AVI
IFOEDIT - latest version
TMPGENC - Purchased latest version

Basically rip the DVD with SMARTRIPPER - don't demux or anything
Use IFOEDIT to remove all soundtracks you don't want etc. Follow normal instructions for using IFOEDIT, we are not trying to spilt into 2DVDS just remove unwanted soundtracks etc.

You should now have a working DVD in a sub-folder. Call it video_ts and test with WinDVD, it should be fully working, chapters, everything. If it is under 4.5GB burn it now, if not follow the steps below.

Shut down IFOEDIT

Run DVD2AVI and select OPEN. Add the first VOB and the rest should be added automatically. Make sure the Dolby Digital DEMUX option is selected from the Audio menu. Click File | Save Project. IT should create a d2v and ac3 file which will take about 5-10 minutes.

Shut down DVD2AVI we have done with that

Run IFOEDIT
Open up your new shorter film (IFO) in the video_ts folder.

First we create a chapters file for later
Click VTS_PGCITI in the top frame and the PGC file in that folder. Now select TOOLS | SAVE CELL TIMES into CellTimes.txt

Click "Create TMPEng" button. Enter a filename, default TmpgTemplate.TXT is OK. Select IFRAMES only. After few seconds click CANCEL. Select the "standard" frame layout in the dialog that appears, the IBBPBBB???? that occurs most often and click OK. You should end up with the TXT file after IFOEDIT has scanned all the files.

Now we need to calculate the compression rate
In the file menu we can calculate compression bitrate. I use the following: DVD size 4500, Length film = ??, Soundtrack = 1 (DD), Subtitles 0. For a 150 min film we get something like 4.800 (which we enter as 4800 in tmpgenc later)

Close down IFOEDIT

So now we have 4 extra files.

CellTimes.txt - the chapter layout
TmpgTemplate.txt - the frame definitions
whatever.d2v - the DVD2AVI project file
whatever.ac3 - the Dolby Digital soundtrack from DVD2AVI

and a bitrate like 4800.

If you feel like it use VOBEDIT to create a subtitles demux which we will use later.

Now we can play with TmpgEnc. I assume you have been into options and set your CPU type etc and we doing PAL

Run TmpgEnc
Select ES Video Only - bottom left
Enter video source as the whatever.d2v file
Enter output as whatever.m2v
Now click Settings, you will get a 4 tabbed dialog.

Tab VIDEO
Stream Type : MPEG2-Video
Size : 720x576, change for NTSC
Aspect : 16:9, change if necessary
Frames : 25, change for NTSC
Rate Control : 2 Pass
--- Click Settings -
--- Avg - whatever IFOEDIT calculated (eg. 4800 for 1hr 50)
--- Max 7000
--- Min 2000
--- Tick Enable padding
--- Click OK to exit dialog
Profile : Main Profile & Main Level
Format : PAL
Mode : Interlace
YUV : 4:2:0
DC : 9 bits
Motion : Highest Quality

Tab ADVANCED
Type : interlaced
Field Order : Bottom First
Aspect : 16:9
Video Arrange : Full keep aspect
No other options are ticked

Tab GOP
I never altered any of these settings, from top to bottom they read 1,4,2,1,15 just in case.
Tick FORCE PICTURE SETTINGS and click SETTINGS button next to it
Wait a few moments (don't know why such a big pause, be patient)
Click LOAD
Select TmpgTemplate.TXT you created with IFOEDIT
Wait even longer (minutes, lots of, maybe 10, be very patient)
Click OK

Click OK to close the SETTINGS dialog

At this point I did a SAVE SETTINGS which can be reloaded next time. It will default some of the options we have set above.

Click START.
Wait 5 hours or so (Twin Athlon 2.2)

You should have a nice new whatever.m2v. Drag into WinDVD to prove it's OK. It should be around 3.9GB to be able to fit a single DVD. You may have to repeat (another 5 hours) with higher compression if it's bigger than 4.0GB, it depends on size of AC3 file.

Now we create a new DVD with IFOEDIT.
Run IFOEDIT
Go into new Author DVD menu

Video Source : whatever.m2v (from TmpgEnc)
Sound Source : whatever.ac3 (from DVD2AVI)
Chapters : CellTimes.txt (from IFOEDIT)
SubStreams : see below (from VOBEDIT)
Output : Some empty directory

Click START, wait 20 minutes and we have a new DVD with chapters and AC3 soundtrack.

Burn with NERO!

Haven't tried subtitles but I think you should be able to demux with VOBEDIT and include in the DVD Author process above.

Have fun!

[Antonio S.]

Sorry, but it doesn't work for NTSC film type movies...

Antonio S.

[charker]

Do you know the reason why?

charker

[DenFussell]

Antonio S.-

What aspect doesn't work with NTSC movies?

I recently did "Something About Mary" and except for the fact that I didn't set the compression rate properly (it was set too low and the video quality was lousy), everything functioned well using pretty much the procedure presented here with the exception of NTSC settings instead of PAL.

[rca29]

Charker,

That method works for PAL dvd's also, but you may have another problem:

The subtitles !

Unfortunately, you will find that using VobEdit will cause you to loose the subtitles when your movie has more than one Vob-Id (you will get ONLY the subtitles from the first Vob Id).
A few days ago, SubToSup came out, suggesting another working method (see Doom9's News from 12/2002). I tried with 2 movies and i got all the subtitles... ...but with a added delay for every Vob-Id :(.

I'm still trying, reading and i hope that a solution will be found...

Today, the only way to have a sucessfull transcode using ifoedit is using REMPEG2. The quality isn't that great, but it's the only thing that works the ifoedit's remux function, and as i think that Derrow will never do anything more on ifoedit, i advise you to trying to use a complete authoring program like scenarist, etc.

The only thing that i don't understand is why doom9 has released the TMPEG Guide For IfoEdit, because it doesn't seem to work for almost anyone !
But we have to forgive that, because there are a lot of other great articles that actually work.

Kind Regards

[rca29]

and you may still have another problem: - The Audio Delay

If you have a movie with a big audio delay (-66 ms as an example) you cannot input that number directly in IfoEdit (there's a limit on the negative range...)

Sorry if i destroyed your dream of the perfect solution for TMPGEnc & IFOEDIT REMUX, but i also had a dream once...

...and i'm still trying to reach it... ...with another software.


Happy New Year

[Antonio S.]

The problem is that in the resulting vob files, the video freeze and the audio is not running at the same speed as the video. Sometimes when playing the movie, in the first 2 or 3 minutes everything works fine, both then video begins to jerk ,to stop suddenly, etc. Maybe this is because a bug in TMPGEnc when doing NTSC movies (Film type) with pulldown. Somehow the TMPG encoder doesn't build exactly the GOP structure from the template generated by Ifoedit...However a lot of people has use this TMPGEnc/Ifoedit method succesfully with PAL movies.

You can find more information about this problem in this same forum...
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39893

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38372

Regards,
Antonio S.

[DenFussell]

rca29-

The audio delay problem with IFOEdit authoring can be compensated for with a small utility called 'AC3 Delay Corrector', which will bring the delay within range of IFOEdit's capabilities.

Does anyone have a lead on whether Derrow has cut off communications?

I sent an e-mail to him at Derrow@yahoo.com and had it returned as undeliverable.

The ifoedit authoring function is a great tool for me because I do simple movie only backups with no subtitles.

I also have no problem with Rempeg2 because it looks as good to me on NTSC as Tmpgenc does but unfortunately there are several DVD's out there that won't work with Rempeg2 due to the way they were assembled with different video sources.

I hope Derrow will continue with his work on IFOEdit either on his own or through a commercial enterprise.

I have no problem paying for a product that works.

Thanks for responding Antonio S. !

Happy New Year!

[Antonio S.]

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Antonio S.

[DenFussell]

Antonio S.

Have you tried authoring (with a TMPGEnc generated .m2v file) as opposed to remuxing an NTSC film with IFOEdit latest?

I have had really clean smooth results by leaving out the IFOEdit generated TMPGENC template and just authoring with the elmentary audio & video streams. Even smoother than a good Rempeg2 authoring session.

A & V synch is good from start to finish if you use the AC3 Delay Corrector when needed.

The thing I dislike so much about TmPgEnc is that there are so many parameters that can be fouled up.

I guess if it was easy, it wouldn't be any fun!

[Antonio S.]

@DenFussell:

Yes, I have tried authoring m2v files created with TMPGEnc with excellent results !!! I even have a template for DVD ntsc-film. You can download it at my site...

Antonio S.
www.antonio.owns.it

[DenFussell]

Antonio S.

I checked out your template and it works fine.

I have one question though. On the two movies I've succeeded in backing up using TMPGENC, I can't find a reliable way to calculate the bitrate settings for Automatic CQ. They both were around 3gb and I don't like to give up that much data, I would rather fill up the DVDR, or at least come close.

Then I tried Titanic and so far it's come out too big twice.

Is there a way to calculate what those settings should be based on the particular movie at hand?

Using Rempeg2, I am always able to calculate it pretty darn close.

Thanks!

[Antonio S.]

@DenFussell:



I have one question though. On the two movies I've succeeded in backing up using TMPGENC, I can't find a reliable way to calculate the bitrate settings for Automatic CQ. They both were around 3gb and I don't like to give up that much data, I would rather fill up the DVDR, or at least come close.

That is the problem with automatic CQ...
However for that template (aproximate values) in "Rate Control Mode", having a "QUALITY" of 25, would let you encode about 120 min with 1 AC3 5.1 audio. If you need to encode about 3 hours, lower the "QUALITY" to 19. For 90 min you can increase "QUALITY" to 30.
Only experimenting you will find the correct setting...

Antonio S.

[DenFussell]

Antonio S.-

Thank you for replying.

I did some experiments with one of the two movies and found that with the max bitrate set at 4500, there was no change in file size with a quality setting of 50 or 100. I found I had to lower it to 45 to begin to see a decrease in file size.

I suppose this would vary from movie to movie depending on APL values and amount of motion, etc.

I like the look of the TMPGEnc files, but for ease of operation and repeatability, I still favor ReMpeg2.

I've found ways to deal with RemPeg2's problems in almost all situations but recently found with two movies that I had to go the TMpgEnc route.

Thanks for your help!

[drafty]

When I remux with ifoedit a tmpgenc generated m2v. The template that ifoedit has generated I edit with a home brew program that scans the produced template and leaves only I frames in the template. Using this method I have never had a problem. I think tmpgenc sometimes gets confused when using IPB frames which is what you get if you select I frames only in ifoedit, just check the template file. You can probably do the processing with a decent editor.

Drafty.

:D