Do I have to deinterlace PAL DV?

[ggtop]

Hi,

I read a lot about deinterlacing, but i couldn't find my "simple" question answered...
I have some dozens DV tapes (Sony HC 44E, PAL) which I want to convert to DVD.
I transfered them to my PC using WinDV. This worked fine. After reading about dv codecs I decided to use cedocida as decoder. I also tried some authoring software. At the moment I use AVStoDVD which generates a basic avisynth script.

So now my question is if I have to deinterlace the content in order to play on my TV (CRT at the moment, LCD hopefully around christmas).

And if so which deinterlacer is recommended?

Maybe I can participate from your experiences.

Thanks a lot in advance

ggtop

[2Bdecided]

No. No need to deinterlace to put it onto DVD.

Deinterlacing it would make it look far worse - stuttery.

Cheers,
David.

[Gser]

My God people still use CRTs? I haven't seen one in years. Personally though, I wouldn't deinterlace them since you would lose fields in this case since DVDs don't support 50fps.

[Ghitulescu]

The DVDs are interlaced only. Consumer DV is also interlaced (mostly).

@gser: CRTs are much better than LCDs of today, with SD content. The studios still use CRTs for controlling the signal, even for HDTV.

[ggtop]

Thank you for your quick responses.
I tried deinterlacing on a small clip with LeakKernelDeint(threshold=50) and indeed the result doesn't look good on CRT.

But also the overall video quality isn't as good as I expected. The video has more grain than the original.

Do you use filters on the source material?

BTW I don't want to treat all the videos with different filters. I want to use the same settings for all the material as I have 30 hours of DV stuff and I don't want to finish at christmas ;-)

ggtop

[Guest]

Don't do any filtering unless the video cries out for it.

Leave it interlaced. Do the minimum needed to put it into DVD format.

[TheSkiller]

But also the overall video quality isn't as good as I expected. The video has more grain than the original.
Which MPEG2 encoder do you use? And what bitrate? Home recorded DV stuff usually needs a high bitrate. From my years of experience with DV to DVD I can say you can fit 80-90 minutes of DV onto a DVD without visible quality loss, more and the quality drops for sure.

Oh, and yes of course it'll look much better on a CRT. You shouldn't dump your CRT as soon as you get an LCD because there's always a need for CRTs, imo.

[ggtop]

Fist thank you all for replying. I'm glad to hear that i don't have to deinterlace and there's no need for filters if it is a "normal" recording.

I use HCEnc 0.24 (beta 04-04-2010) at the moment at very high bitrates (~7MBit). When I finished testing different apps for my purpose I will end up at bitrates that will let me put ~90 min per disc. I agree with you. i use AVStoDVD at the moment and in my current setup it automatically sets the bitrate (this is why it is that high).

And I think most of my family begin to sleep after approx. 1 hour, so there is no need to put as much as possible per disc :)

[2Bdecided]

And I think most of my family begin to sleep after approx. 1 hour, so there is no need to put as much as possible per disc :)Home movies? I think anyone still watching at 1x speed after more than ten minutes is just being polite!

Cheers,
David.

[ggtop]

Home movies? I think anyone still watching at 1x speed after more than ten minutes is just being polite!

Cheers,
David.

It depends on who has the remote control :)

[bb]

The DVDs are interlaced only. Consumer DV is also interlaced (mostly)...
DVDs can be either interlaced or progressive. Most DV footage is interlaced, but there's progressive DV, too.

bb

[Ghitulescu]

DVDs can be either interlaced or progressive. Most DV footage is interlaced, but there's progressive DV, too.

bb

The DVD is progressive when it contain VCD-like video.

It may contain progressive footage, but then it should be marked as such and encoded with pulldown (progressive video, encoded as interlaced with the film mode marker set), so the player can IVTC the material back to progressive, if needed.

Consumer DV is interlaced. I think people like to call prosumer that category that has not enough money to buy pro gear but they like to have, for extra money, some gimmicks. Progressive DV belongs then to prosumers.

[bb]

The DVD is progressive when it contain VCD-like video.
What is "VCD-like video"? Are you talking about quarter resolution video? No, DVDs can be progressive at full resolution. Many - if not most - movie DVDs are progressive. Even the MPEG-2 streams in the VOBs are flagged non-interlaced.

It may contain progressive footage, but then it should be marked as such and encoded with pulldown (progressive video, encoded as interlaced with the film mode marker set), so the player can IVTC the material back to progressive, if needed.
Progressive DVDs don't require neither pulldown nor IVTC. Are we talking the same language here?

Consumer DV is interlaced. I think people like to call prosumer that category that has not enough money to buy pro gear but they like to have, for extra money, some gimmicks. Progressive DV belongs then to prosumers.
That's just not true. My good old Canon MV3 consumer camcorder features a true progressive mode (which I prefer over interlaced recording, by the way). Most consumer camcorders record interlaced footage only, though.

bb

[Ghitulescu]

Sorry if I wrongly understand the DVD specs, but AFAIK there is no progressive DVD video stored as progressive on a DVD-Video. Because at the time when these specs were drafted very few if any TV sets, no DVD player and no progressive standards existed.

Yes, this marker instructs the player to perform the IVTC if the chain allowed a progressive mode and the user wanted to have it. Some players respect this flag, some ignore it, some perform themselves the "film detection".

VCD-like is actually VCD video stored in a VOB container (DVD structure). It's like because it's a bit more restrictive than the original VCD standard (eg shorter GOP size). I'm not talking here about 352x288 MPEG-2 files, but 352x288 MPEG-1 ones. 240 for NTSC.

I don't have access to the DVD specs, the few NTSC DVDs I have are interlaced, so if one knows better please let me know.

[Guest]

As always keep in mind the distinction between the content and the encoding.

MPEG-2 progressive_sequence is not allowed, but interlaced sequences can contain progressive pictures and progressive macroblocks.

[Ghitulescu]

It's exactly what I wanna say, but in fewer words :)