Dxva HD Compatiblity requirements

[CommonMortal]

Hello. Since i don't use MeGUI and googling wasn't much of a help, could someone tell me the requirements to ensure dxva compatible mkv?

I read it's High@4.1, but i took a look at all megui profiles and for example they have 3 b frames. Does this mean that above 3 b frames it's not compatible?


The only "complete" guide i found was from the handbrake forum, which was stating in a post:

DXVA compliancy consists of three parts:
- The number of reference frames
- Macroblock options: no P4x4 blocks
- Maximum bitrate of 50000 kbit


The number of reference frames
***1080P Normal movie + Animation***
ref= 4 (max. resolution = 1920x1088) < 3 ref = not good enough for AHD
ref= 5 (max. resolution = 1920x864) < 3 ref = not good enough for AHD
ref= 6 (max. resolution = 1920x720) < 3 ref = not good enough for AHD

***720p Normal movie + Animation***
ref= 09 (max. resolution = 1280x720) < 5 ref = not good enough for AHD
ref= 10 (max. resolution = 1280x648) < 5 ref = not good enough for AHD
ref= 11 (max. resolution = 1280x588) < 5 ref = not good enough for AHD
ref= 12 (max. resolution = 1280x540) < 5 ref = not good enough for AHD

Macroblock options: no P4x4 blocks
- analyse=0x3:0x113 (anything else is either bad or not dxva compliant)

Maximum bitrate of 50000 kbit
- vbv_maxrate= (50000 max.)

When all these requirements are met, the encode is DXVA compliant.


Is that all? So if you keep the rules for reference frames and enforce a H4.1 profile (AsxGUI does that), then for the rest you are free to put any setting you like (including more b frames?)

Thank you in advance.

[Keiyakusha]

Not sure about your quote but requirements depends on hardware and drivers. Some nvidia cards can play everything up to level 5.1 16refs, some ATI cards I believe too (I heard this happened not so long ago). High@4.1 is a requirement for blu-ray spec. Since all cards theoretically should support bluray, High@4.1 probably just a safe choice.

[julius666]

Hello. Since i don't use MeGUI and googling wasn't much of a help, could someone tell me the requirements to ensure dxva compatible mkv?

I read it's High@4.1, but i took a look at all megui profiles and for example they have 3 b frames. Does this mean that above 3 b frames it's not compatible?

The only "complete" guide i found was from the handbrake forum, which was stating in a post:

Is that all? So if you keep the rules for reference frames and enforce a H4.1 profile (AsxGUI does that), then for the rest you are free to put any setting you like (including more b frames?)

And what is "AHD"?

Thank you in advance.

b frames number has nothing to do with DXVA compatibility. You can set it as high as you want.

I myself use preset veryslow with level 4.0/4.1 compliant ref frames number, and plays fine on my HD4830.

[CommonMortal]

Thank you both. Because i like using 5 b-frames and not so many reference frames.

Yesterday i encoded a video (720p) with 5 ref frames and 5 b frames and ffdshow dxva was playing it, even when set to adhere to strict requirements. So i was puzzled when i read this handbrake post and saw the megui settings (with 3 b frames).

< 5 ref = not good enough for AHD

It means, that as long as ref frames are above 5, it's compatible i guess? I hope so, because i never use 10,11,12 ref frames.


I 've an ATI 5450.

[shon3i]

For DXVA is only mandatory number of reference frames and VBV, that meet according level.

[Selur]

iirc for some (all?) cards resolution needs to be mod16

[CommonMortal]

For DXVA is only mandatory number of reference frames and VBV, that meet according level.

Yes, the reference frames certainly have something to do with it, because ffdshow dxva has a setting to ignore reference frames and try to force everything to play with dxva or not.

Thanks anyway, i was more concerned about the b frames mostly. Now i know they 're ok.

[Guest]

All discussion of torrents and trackers is prohibited here. Posts have been deleted and edited.

[doc_dvxm]

All discussion of torrents and trackers is prohibited here. Posts have been deleted and edited.


You are wellcome :).

[Guest]

You are wellcome :). Struck for rule 11.

[hopstiii]

Does preset placebo overrun Level 4.1?

[sneaker_ger]

Does preset placebo overrun Level 4.1?

Depends on the resolution. But you can limit the number of ref frames with "--level 4.1".

[hopstiii]

Depends on the resolution. But you can limit the number of ref frames with "--level 4.1".

Yes i'm using the level 4.1 from GUI of Virtualdub vfw X264 encoder, video is 1280x720. Will the level 4.1 cancel placebo preset options not meeting 4.1 values.
Is the --min-keyint 1 good for DXVA (default 25-30)

http://static3.nagi.ee/i/p/723/80/180950913729d0_o.jpg

[sneaker_ger]

I'm not familiar with the vfw version, so I don't know if setting level has any impact on the number of ref frames.

min-keyint has no impact on DXVA compatibility, so just leave it at the default unless you know what you are doing (which you are not).

[hopstiii]

So far 8 reference frames is highest that my HD-3870 has played with DXVA. Havent tested up from there. A lot 5 ref, files played down.

Ati driver should support fully HD2000 and Hd3000 series @ level 5.1

Im sure my super tiny 4670 1Gb plays even 16 ref.

[sneaker_ger]

So far 8 reference frames is highest that my HD-3870 has played with DXVA. Havent tested up from there. A lot 5 ref, files played down.

The number of allowed ref frames for a given level depends on the resolution. See Wikipedia.

Ati driver should support fully HD2000 and Hd3000 series @ level 5.1

Are you sure? I've read you need at least a HD4xxx card for that. That would also explain this:
Im sure my super tiny 4670 1Gb plays even 16 ref.

[hopstiii]

The number of allowed ref frames for a given level depends on the resolution. See Wikipedia.

Are you sure? I've read you need at least a HD4xxx card for that. That would also explain this:

I read it from here about 2000 3000 series.
http://forums.finalgear.com/technology/how-to-do-gpu-accelerated-x264-mkv-1080p-playback-39287/page-3/

Level 5.1 for 2000/3000 series and up, yes 4 r frames max,
but i have only tested 4 ref frames of 1080p and 8 ref frames of 720p.

[sneaker_ger]

From your link:
HOWEVER, HD2000 and HD3000 series ATI video cards still have limitations on the maximum Reference Frames. ONLY HD4000 and HD5000 series videocards can now accelerate H264 videos up to Level 5.1 with up to 16 Reference frames.
Unfortunately, this is a HARDWARE issue, so no driver will EVER fix that.

[hopstiii]

From your link:

I understood the only limitations is on the maximum Reference Frames.
-------

Oo yes 720p level 4.1 max is --ref 9 and 1080p --ref 4.
No better way to test it out, then it's for sure if other Level 5.1 options work.

[roozhou]

Level 5.1 for 2000/3000 series and up, yes 4 r frames max,
but i have only tested 4 ref frames of 1080p and 8 ref frames of 720p.
HD 42xx IGPs (785G, 880G, 890G) still give bad frames on L5.1 H264 video.

[hopstiii]

HD 42xx IGPs (785G, 880G, 890G) still give bad frames on L5.1 H264 video.

Then i'm gonna stick with L4.1.

[hopstiii]

Has anybody tested if DXVA will decode smooth --me tesa encoded 720p 1080p files?

[nurbs]

--me can't have an influence on decoding.

[hopstiii]

--me can't have an influence on decoding.

That's good :), i have years and years figured if one of the most important quality option that slows down encoding most will influence decoding speed.

[nurbs]

tesa doesn't bring much quality gain, you shouldn't expect much more than 1 or 2% gain over UMH. That it is only turned on in --preset placebo means that it is among the worst options in regard to the ratio of quality gain to extra time spent.

[hopstiii]

tesa doesn't bring much quality gain. That it is only turned on in --preset placebo means that it is among the worst options in regard to the ratio of quality gain to extra time spent.

I figured it must be really good if that's that slow.
I read from somewhere it's not very much better than uneven multi hexagon (i use that for most movie rips).
------

Look at that 1080p, it runs on C2D e4500 2,2GHz not smooth at all,
it freezes a lot CPU use 85-100%.

But in DXVA HD-3870 512MB, CPU use is 10% and fps just perfect

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1h 34mn
Bit rate : 10.5 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 800 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.40:1
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.285
Stream size : 6.78 GiB (81%)
Title : x264
Writing library : x264 core 104 r1703 cd21d05
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=5 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=umh /
subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.20 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 /
8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-6 / threads=12 /
sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=1 /
b_adapt=1 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=0 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=23 /
scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=40 / rc=2pass / mbtree=1 / bitrate=10484 / ratetol=1.0 /
qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00

[hopstiii]

RipBot264 tested settings for 1280x720 that are DXVA compatible on Ati HD-3870 with MPC-HC :)

16 b frames / 9 reference frames....look screenshot.

http://static3.nagi.ee/i/p/725/4/1812605149a4b5_o.jpg

[Juce]

I did some tests with ATI HD 5450 and Windows XP: http://forums.amd.com/game/messageview.cfm?catid=279&threadid=135419&enterthread=y&STARTPAGE=2#1220209

Looks like there is no logic with Catalyst 10.10.

[hopstiii]

Nice test Juce

Shortly
DVD encodings: 14 Ref Frames
Blu-Ray encodings: 9 for 720p / 4 for 1080p

That's pretty good quality allready.
------------------------------------------------

I did an fully DXVA compatible encode and was wandering what can i change for more better quality,
and what's qpstep=4 (4 was default, what's good, is 69 or 1 better there)?

General
Complete name : G:\720p video encode.mp4
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media
Codec ID : isom
File size : 87.1 MiB
Duration : 4mn 53s
Overall bit rate : 2 493 Kbps
Encoded date : UTC 2011-04-22 17:00:40
Tagged date : UTC 2011-04-22 17:00:40

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.1
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 8 frames
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 4mn 53s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 2 500 Kbps
Maximum bit rate : 14.1 Mbps
Width : 1 280 pixels
Height : 720 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 30.000 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.090
Stream size : 87.0 MiB (100%)
Writing library : x264 core 114 r1924 08d04a4
Encoding settings : cabac=1 / ref=9 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=tesa / subme=10 /
psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=40 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 /
8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=3 / sliced_threads=0 /
nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=16 / b_pyramid=1 /
b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=1 / scenecut=40 /
intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=60 / rc=2pass / mbtree=1 / bitrate=2500 /
ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=0 / qpmax=69 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / vbv_maxrate=50000 /
vbv_bufsize=50000 / nal_hrd=none / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Encoded date : UTC 2011-04-22 17:00:40
Tagged date : UTC 2011-04-22 17:00:41

[fransky]

no p4x4 is not necessary any more, right?

[nurbs]

Has turning it off ever been necessary. I also heard that it's not compatible with DXVA and the PS3 years ago, but personally I never had any issues with it.