video distortions and artifacts

[SiliconSoul]

well i need some help and im not sure what im doing wrong... ive ripped a few movies to svcd now and im getting video screw ups...

they are not horribly bad.. just annoying as hell!

these happen on my computer with powerdvd and in my apex ad-1000

it happens at the same places....

ive made sure the cds are not scratched, dirty, etc,
i have cleaned them with a eye glasses cloth and only from the inside of the disc out...

i even burned a cd ( tdk 80 min) making sure that i did not scratch putting it in the cdr and taking it out and putting in the apex... ( still using the same image i originaly burned with)

problem still happens... its almost as if cce had a glitch while encoding..

is this possible? what else could it be? is ther a way to fix it?

or im just sol and have to deal with it?

[Mozart]

software burner? Any more informations?

[chainsaw135]

What programs are you using 2 make your svcd's?

after I get that information i might be able 2 respond with more help:)

[24hourloop]

What do you mean by these glitches. I generally have one to two temporal glitches in a movie but barely noticeable.

Can you describe this a bit better?

[markrb]

What bitrate did you use?
Why don't you post your DVD2SVCD.log file.

We can't help unless you tell us something more then it doesn't play right.

Mark

[SiliconSoul]

i used cdrwin to burn with on a plextor 8/20 scsi

im always using dvd2svcd

ill try and take a picture with powerdvd if i can...

and i deleted the whole dir besides the bin and cue files... i should have kept that! SHIT!

well my bit rate was max 2723 max average 2230 min 300


yeah i and knew taht you would need more info i jsut did not know what! i should have known that you would needed the logs! DUH!

im going to try and find a frame with it in it right now... ill reply once i do...

[chainsaw135]

what format is the movie PAL or NTSC?

[SiliconSoul]

ntsc and there is a horrible audio pop during when this happens...
the audio pop is in the same exact place everytime and it is just once.. sound like a chirp...
but the video is not the same everytime... but there are video messups at the smae time everytime... just do not look the same each time...

this happens for a good 5-10mins in the movie


anyway weird!

okay the movie is american pie 2
sorry about where the images are from but this is where it happens!

:-)

the only way and quickest way was a yahoo briefcasr i jsut made and here is the link to the pics...


http://briefcase.yahoo.com/siliconsoul2002

ps im uploading right now should show up in the next 10 mins..

[chainsaw135]

Hey i just did american pie 2 the other day with dvd2svcd so lets see if we can figure this out.

I think your putting the bitrate 2 high...try this just for fun ok?

try 2350 or around that # and the max average around 2230 see how that works out for you.

I had the 16:9 version also not sure if you have the 4:3 or not but i did my version with only using 1900max bitrate and min 300 i used temporal smooth tho but it turned out darn good.
Normally i try and do over 2000 for max bitrate and i would not use temporal smooth unless birate is low like 1900... i wanted 2 fit this movie on only 2 disks.

[SiliconSoul]

im wanting to get the best quality i can... and i did not care if it went to 3 cds... but even with my high bitrate it did not... it was still on 2 cds...

would a too high bitrate cause those problems?

yes i also had the 16:9 version

yours still looked good with jsut a max of 1900?

what is temperal smooth? is it a setting i can check? if not how do i use it?

btw with this dvd i also noticed after i was done taht the last vob was all credits so you could have taken that out to get it shorter....

if you see where it started ( pics from above ) and it when for a few more mins... every once in a while once a min.. twice a min those video screwups woud happen..

[SiliconSoul]

could this be a ripping problem? dvd drive going bad? im using a toshiba 1401 scsi

if its bitrate i would think that is kind of odd... im not thinking its that but maybe...

[chainsaw135]

Yes a 2 high bitrate will cause those problems if you want high quality do 4 pass vbr with a setting of 2350 max and 2230 max average also you could change the min 300 to lets say 600 in the bitrate tab section that will help.

not sure if you were using vbr or cbr but vbr 4 pass with those bitrates should be sweet looking and also put your sound at like 192 or 224 either one is fine.

[SiliconSoul]

also the movie ends like 5 mins before the end... and there are no credits... thats now it fit on 2 cds...

[SiliconSoul]

wow it will that sucks...

i did a 5 pass vbr

audio was at 224

[chainsaw135]

ALso if you want a sharper picture do BicubicReize with a factor of 0.60 instead of 0.75 if you want smooth type picture select BilinearResize...both of those resize methods can be found
under the FrameServer Tab.

[nfl2k2]

Whats' the difference betwean Bilinear resize and bicubic resize? is one better than the other?

[SiliconSoul]

well for me time is not an issue if it takes 12 hours ohh well... to get the best quality is what i would like... if it takes 3 cds ohh well... and if it takes a 20 pass vbr then so be it!
i have an amd xp 1700+ and 512 ram so my machine does it in a decent amount of time...

thanks for the help! ill have to try those settings...

im not sure why the video cuts out becuase i had enough hd... it was when it was making the bin files that it ran out... it should have finished the video although... if you can put some insight on that!

:)

[markrb]

Something sounds messed up because I did AP2 with 2500 Max and it went on three cd's. I re-did the encode at CBR 2500 and it ended up on 4, but the forth was like 7mb so I didn't care that 10 seconds of credits were missing. My copy was 4:3 (couldn't get my hands on the 16:9), but it shouldn't make an entire CD difference. You may have intended to encode at a higher bitrate, but the DVD2SVCD settings may have reduced your bitrate to fit onto the number of Cd's listed. If you want to make sure you get the Max Avg you set then set all the number of cd's 1 higher then default. Occasionaly you may end up having to reduce the bitrate to have it fit your needs, but once you get the hang of it it's easy enough to figure out.

Seriously CCE maxes out quality at 4 passes and most of the time even at 3. So unless you just have spare time then 5 pass is a total waste.

I don't recomend TS with 3 or 4 pass VBR. DDOGG says that it's just not worth the time and he is a big supporter of TS. I trust his judgement when it comes to many things and this is one of them.

As for you video problem it could be a bitrate issue with the stand alone, but I don't think so with PowerDVD.
Have you tried WinDVD just as another test program?

Most standalone players Max out at 2500 kbits video and you will start having problems any higher then that. Try your next encode at 2500 Max or lower.

Next is to slow your CD-R burn speed down. Many people including myself have issues if they burn a SVCD CD-R at any faster then 4X.
If you are getting jitters, green blocks or other video screw ups that could be the culprit.

Try playing the Muxed Mpg files in WinDVD(don't use media player audio is always screwed up) or maybe PowerDVD(I don't use it so I don't know if you can). If the files play fine it is either you Cd-R burn speed, CD-R drive, CD-R media or your Stand Alone player. The files will only be there if you had Don't Delete Files checked.

Make sure you are using the 1.0 version of BeSweet. You can check the txt file in the BeSweet directory to see what version it is. If it's not 1.0 then grab the copy from the BeSweet sticky.

Give those things a shot and see what happens,

Mark

[chainsaw135]

1.Yeah I use temporal smoother on anything under 2000 even if i do 3 or 4 pass.

2.Yes you can use powerdvd 2 play the svcd mpeg files

[Kedirekin]

I haven't seen this suggested yet.

I'd definately check that the original rip was okay. The fact that the video and audio become corrupt at the same time is a strong indicator that it was not.

They're are a variety of ways to do this (FlasK, a software player, d2v with TMpg, d2v->vfapi->vDub). In my opinion, vDub is the easiest GUI to use for this. You can even attach the wav file.

Use the vfapi reader codec tool to make a psuedo-avi from the d2v file, open the psuedo-avi in vDub, then use go-to from the edit menu to go to the approximate time where the corruption appears. Then you can scroll through, and even single-frame-step through. If you see the corruption in vDub, it's almost certain that the rip is bad.

[markrb]

Kedirekin wouldn't playing the original Vob files in WinDVD in file mode be a good way to check the Vob files and the rip?

You could also manually load the Vob files into Dvd2avi, run the slider bar on the bottom and see if it is corrupted.

Mark

[chainsaw135]

markrb...Thats how i've always checked 2 see if the vob files were fine or not:)...Just load them in to dvd2avi

[Kedirekin]

Yep :) . Playing the vobs in a software DVD player is one of the ways to check.

To avoid confusion, I only wanted to mention one way, and I didn't suggest a software player because; 1) I wasn't sure how he ripped (which can complicate software player playback), 2) software players may be able to 'repair' small corruptions, 3) you might very well miss a single-frame corruption with full-speed playback (though the fact that he saw the corruption when playing back the SVCD mitigates this point).

Similarly, you might miss single-frame corruptions (or even multi-frame corruptions) when previewing in dvd2avi. It plays back very fast, and if your just holding down the right-cursor key, I'm pretty sure you only see the i-frames.

[markrb]

Yep putting them in DVD2AVI is just a quick and messy way to check them, but it has also shown me my bad VOB's too.

Since the screencaps where with a software DVD player I would suspect that playing the Vob files would show problems too if they existed in the original files, but it isn't perfect either.

I looked at the screen caps SiliconSoul did and it does show the kind of errors a too fast CD-R creation can make, but there are other ways to get those errors as well.

Definately check the Muxed.mpg files if you have them with PowerDVD or WinDVD to see if the errors as there as well. If not it is definately a CD-R issue.

Mark

[SiliconSoul]

would it be a too fast burn if it happened on two different copies? same place...

i burn at 8x on a plextor and have never had a problem with audio or any types of data before!

i do not think that is it although....

i think my dvd drive is failing or overheating...

my cdr is in the top bay and the dvd is the next one down.... ( maybe too close?)

and when i tryied to rip a dvd the other day i came back about 10 mins later and ( was not using dvd2svcd... was making a divx) smartripper was at .02 and the drive was still reading ( it got about half way into the dvd) but it looked as it was going nuts to read that one part and the cd was not scratched or dirty! lots of bad blocks... i stopped it and the dvd came out kinda hot...

ive only had this happen when ripping an audio cd with scratches.... because of the extented time it takes to try to extract the audio...


with this information... do you think my dvd is failing? the scsi bus? scsi cable?

what could it be? :confused:

[SiliconSoul]

ps thanks for all the suggestons and help! this forum is great!

[SiliconSoul]

Whats' the difference betwean Bilinear resize and bicubic resize? is one better than the other?

the Temperal smooth when should i use this..

how do i know what bitrate to use for which movies? i know now that i do not need to blow out the bitrate to get good quality..



********* 2nd part***********

btw you guys have some BADA$$ answers.....

i have a suggestion...

you guys need to merge heads and do a FAQ. ( everyone that has messed with the different settings)
cause encoding takes a long time even with a fast machine!

but not your normal faq

one where you go through dvd2svcd by tab explaining each option. what it does.. where its best to use it.. when its best not to use it.

it could be at the top of the advanced and newbie forum and would probably answer lost of questions!

the faq on the doom9.net page tell you what to set but not why and when to use it and when not to use it..

i hope you undertand what i mean.... like this is better for action movies, anime, cartoons, 3d graphics , etc

each option has its explaination of what it does and how the setting can be set (for different uses) and what type of movie it is good for...

:)

[Mozart]

faq??!! What about this (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?threadid=8127), this (http://www.edensrising.com/dvd2svcd/dvd2svcd_newbieref.html),
this (http://www.edensrising.com/dvd2svcd/dvd2svcd_advref.html),
this (http://www.edensrising.com/dvd2svcd/dvd2svcd_avi2svcdref.html) and this (http://rilanparty.com/vbb/showthread.php?threadid=5686)? Aren't they enough for you?

[SiliconSoul]

nope! :D

wow thanks i have only found 2 of the ones you have listed THANKS!

[Mozart]

Originally posted by SiliconSoul
nope! :D

vadisefudfdedfrsdffdfilhdffodadfpdutdfa!

[markrb]

Hey SiliconSoul how much exactly did you pay for this?

Nobody is making a dime off this. It is all volunteer.

Would you rather have DVD2SVCD spend time on writting FAQ's for people too lazy to try things out or would you rather have a better program.

Anyway burning audio and data has nothing to do with burning SVCD's different animal. You maybe able to burn data at 24X 100% of the time 100% perfect, but only be able to burn SVCD's at 4X. If you notice we put over 807mb's on a 700mb CD-R. Try doing that with an ISO standard data file.

You never said if you tried the mpg files from the hard drive in PowerDVD or WinDVD. This is important! If those are fine we can narrow the problem to after if not then the problem is before.

You also never said if you tried the VOB files like we said to.

If you don't try what we suggest how do you expect us to help?

If you don't have the Muxed_file.mpg then try looking at the .mpv file. You can open it in Windows Media player. There will be no audio, but the video will be the same as the muxed_file.mpg and the final SVCD. These are all after the encode and can help narrow down the problem.

Is your DVD player too close to your CD-R drive? Most likely no. These type of drives usually don't run that hot and are made to be mounted like that.
SmartRipper ripping slow. This could be because of a tough disk. Unlike most ripping programs when SmartRipper hits a tough to read section it will slow down until it reads the data as well as it can. It is of course possible you have a bad DVD drive too though.
If you can watch DVD's from it fine I would learn towards the drive is ok. There are programs out there to test the drive to see if it's bad. I suggest looking on www.tucows.com or www.cnet.com.

Mark

[SiliconSoul]

seriously a better program :)

sorry bout the dumb questions!

and i deleted all the files when i thuoght everything was okay... i watched the movie two days later and that stuff showed up... ill have to rerip it when i get a chance....


so with all svcd i should burn at 4x? does everyone burn them at 4x...? that is kinda crazy sounding... to burn so slow... but it makes sense with how much is being packed onto the cd.

:confused:

[chainsaw135]

Not everyone burns at 4x figure your what speed works for you and use it. I burn at 16x and sometimes 24x...do your tests find out what your sweet spot is.

[SiliconSoul]

ahh okay so if next time my mpeg are fine then there is the problem then its the speed... if the mpegs are screwed it not the cdr its something else.. dvd perhaps...

[markrb]

Ahh yes my son light dawns on yonder head. If you see problems check the mpegs on the HD if they are ok then the problem is in the burning if they are bad the problem is in the encoding or ripping.

AS for the burning issue.
That is why it is some people have problems, but it is a known issue. It comes down to how good your individual burner is and it doesn't matter if it's a $200 one or a $50 one it is how accurate that particular one is. The same exact model can have different results for two different people. 4X is just a safe speed.
It can also matter on your media as well. There are good CD-R disks and OK CD-R disks and cost doesn't seem to matter.
My advice would be for you to play with the settings and find a good safe burn speed. I just changed CDRW drives and now I have no problems at 8X, but before on my HP CDRW I could not burn any faster then 4X and the HP I had was considered one of the better drives of it's time.

Mark

[Wh00pS]

people make me laugh :) they spend 12 hours ripping to svcd and moan about extra 20 mins to burn a cd...hehehe
some folks need a bit of patience :)

[DDogg]

One of the things that will kill you is multitaking while burning due to buffer underruns. That is one of the main reasons they came up with "burnproof". If you stay hands off, and make sure a bunch of stuff is not running in the background, your chances of a successful burn will be much greater.

Speaking of that, I picked up a Lite-On 24x the other day from NewEgg for 95 bucks. Damn thing burned perfectly at 24x....But then again, It HAS burnproof protection. I would strongly suggest that a person never buy a cdr today without that feature.

[chainsaw135]

Yeah dogg I got my "lite on also 24x10x40" like a month ago paid 86.00 but even at 95.00 it rocks..i've been buring movies at 24x with that unless i do overburn i only go at 16x speed has not failed under those conditions. Also I was able 2 fit 830megs of a svcd movie on a 80 minute disk...I tried 850 it failed and also 840 it also failed so I stopped testing...i used cdrw disk for the tests of course:)

@LaberSack... Well my tests are just for fun and not meant for someone 2 put in stone my results...I'm sure anyone could argue against or with my finding. SO with that I take your information and can say I already understood the whole "cdr, cdrw and the name brands and media type of these can differ from which you can overburn" also there are many other factors that I dont wanna add in to that but hey if you or anyone else want 2 add full details and make this a tutorial of overburning with the lite on burner more power to you:)

[Labersack]

I also got this LitOn24x burner. It is able to burn 996MB SVCD on one disk. But you have to use 99min-CDRs.
Chainsaw, you can't test the size of your CDRs with a CDRW, because each brand and type has a different size. The biggest possible size in the ATIp is 79:59, also for 99min CDRs. So you have to overburn, even with 90 or 99 CDRs.
Fireburner can test the size without burning it, try this with your CDRs and you will knowhow far you can go.

[SiliconSoul]

im thinking about taht same burner or the plextor 24x or maybe even the new plextor 40x

[_Vengeance_]

I can't even keep up at 12X. Gone through over 2000 cds in 15 months. I shutter at the thought of 4X. If I were someone that had to burn at 4X to get results, I'd want a new burner.

That being said, Plextor burners work well. But they break. But they give you new ones (on my 3rd, 4th coming soon) -- $200 well spent.

[SiliconSoul]

4x did not fix my problem it was that my apexs did not like the older plextor 8x scsi burner. i now have a lite on 40x and i can burn at 24x and 32x and the movies play FINE! no messups at all once i get some 40x media i can test at 40x but the 24x and 32x media does messup at 40x which i just think the media can not go past its limits.

[MediaMage]

to end this burning issue: this failure happens on my comp with the image mounted via daemon tools...


its very annoying

i encoded star trek tng season 1 .. no problems

the only thing i have changed till season 2 is smart deinterlace > telecide and noise filter OFF to noise filter 2

i used the standard bitrates..

i could post my dvd2svcd file and logs if that would help...

[SiliconSoul]

with the liteon drive i can burn with using nero cdrwin daemon tools and use clonecd to copy. MY problem was totaly an old plextor issue that will never be fixed with the plextor scsi 8/20 cdr