Biggest codec issue 2009

[FelixPaul]

Greetings from Germany,

i think most of you know netbooks? These little Notebooks with super-weak hardware but long battery life getting very popular the last year. Most of them come with an intel N-Atom CPU and intel integrated graphics (GMA950). But some newer model ship with a more advanced Z-Atom and GMA500 (Poulsbo). The biggest advantages to Poulsbo are much lower power consumption as well as hardware video decode acceleration for all of the major codecs (MPEG-2, VC-1, H.264).

There are some devices featuring this platform, like Sony Vaio P, Dell Mini 10 & 12, Acer AO 751 or the upcoming Asus EEEpc 1101. In the future, all new intel-based Netbooks will get the GMA500 GPU included: http://www.netbookchoice.com/2009/06/10/first-details-on-intel-‘pineview’-atom-n400-d400-d500-processors/ Since these devices are very popular, there will be A LOT of people want to use the given hardware. Or not? It seems nobody knows about the hardware decode features in the GMA500. No review writes about it, nor has nVidia a clue (or don´t want to have a clue) an contiues to promote that their ION addon-GPU is the only way to bring HD-Content on a netbook: http://www.nvidia.com/object/IO_73301.html

PROBLEM: there is no out-of-the-box solution to trigger the DXVA-Decoder in your weak GPU. I had to walk throu lots of board until i get mangaged what i want. With success!

Currently i´m able to playback all HD Videos with my Acer Aspire One 751 (GMA500): Super smooth, and only about 20% CPU usage.

H.264 /AVC - 1080p
http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/3108/gma500avc1.jpg

H.264 / AVC - 720p
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/4418/gma500h2641.jpg

WMV / VC-1 - 1080p
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/3254/gma500vc12.jpg

WMV / VC-1 1080p
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/9562/gma500vc11.jpg

Here are parts of a guide i worte in the Dell Mini board for users who have the same issues. I think it describes the problem very well:

I strongly recommend you to try this littel tool:
http://bluesky23.hp.infoseek.co.jp/dxvac/DXVAChecker_2.0.1.2.zip

It shows you the Hardware capebilties of your GPU, and below that a list of installed Codecs which can be used for DXVA playback. Take a look at my screenshots.

Further you should click "Check DirectShow Decoders..." and search for a video file you like to view. In the screenshot i used this: DivX 7 Showcase | DivX.com (http://www.divx.com/en/downloads/divx-7-showcase) rather heavy stuff ;) (1080p H.264, AAC 5.1 Surround, AAC Stereo, 507MB)

With the free codec that comes from "Media Player Classic - HC" there is no problem playing your H.264 Videos. Here is a good guide how to trigger DXVA: Hardware acceleration of HD movies using DXVA - Guides & Tutorials (http://forums.techarena.in/guides-tutorials/1192826.htm)

Playing your VC-1 coded videos like WMV is a bit tricky, but will work. You need a VC-1 decoder which comes directly from intel, but is somehow hidden from their site. Here is a upload: File-Upload.net - Intel_Video_Codecs_GMA500.zip (http://www.file-upload.net/download-1722666/Intel_Video_Codecs_GMA500.zip.html)

If you install it and run that DXVA-Checker Tool, you will see there is another Codec like in my screenshots. "Intel® Media Codecs VC-1 Decoder for Intel® System Controller Hub"

Download some Samples here: WMV HD Content Showcase (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/musicandvideo/hdvideo/contentshowcase.aspx)

Within the DXVA-Checker Tool look for the button "Check Media Foundation Decoders..." click and choose a WMV file. Rightclick on the red text below the intel codec (NV12 (ModeVC1_VLD)) which should look like my screenshots and choose play, enjoy!

With the use of the MPC-Codec and the Intel one for VC-1 you can play every HD-Content with minimal CPU usage on your GMA500. Just make sure you run on DXVA (Hardware GPU acceleration)

PROBLEM: i cannot trigger this Intel VC-1 Codec in any Media Player. Do you have an idea, how to connect this Intel VC-1 decoder (imc_vc1_dec_mf.dll) with a freeware Media-Player like MPC-HC? I hope someone here could help us (GMA500 users) to get this done and (in addition) kick some ass at the nVidia ION team ;) If we can find a working solution/guide for this, we could not only make millions of netbook-buyers happy with full-HD playback, but also support upcoming interesting projects like www.fit-pc2.com


Greetings,
FelixPaul

[nm]

PROBLEM: i cannot trigger this Intel VC-1 Codec in any Media Player. Do you have an idea, how to connect this Intel VC-1 decoder (imc_vc1_dec_mf.dll) with a freeware Media-Player like MPC-HC?
It's a Media Foundation codec, so DirectShow players such as MPC-HC can't use it.

[FelixPaul]

okay, shouldn´t it be possible to use this decoder in the standart windows media player? the option to go over DXVA-checker is really not optimal. There must be a better solution.

[benwaggoner]

Ugh, I realy need to get someone to replace that old WMVHD content showcase. Those files are all 1-pass CBR encodes from five years ago.

Anyway, Win 7 has had a ton of work around enabling SHED and other HD Netbook playback.

There was some good info in this IIRC:
http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/E/6/5E66B27B-988B-4F50-AF3A-C2FF1E62180F/GRA-T585_WH08.pptx

[FelixPaul]

Hello Ben,

i see you have some more insight on this theme than me. Can you confirm that HD-Playback on netbooks will be a great thing in 2009?

The current GMA500 hardware has the possibilities to decode every HD-content you will find, or am i wrong? We (GMA 500 users) lack the support of players, drivers and software in general. The hardware is given. So what can we do? And why does nobody talks about the GMA500, instead is hyping the nVidia ION solution?

Greetings,
Felix

[benwaggoner]

Hello Ben,

i see you have some more insight on this theme than me. Can you confirm that HD-Playback on netbooks will be a great thing in 2009?
On Netbooks with the right hardware and Win 7, absolutely.

The current GMA500 hardware has the possibilities to decode every HD-content you will find, or am i wrong? We (GMA 500 users) lack the support of players, drivers and software in general. The hardware is given. So what can we do? And why does nobody talks about the GMA500, instead is hyping the nVidia ION solution?
I'm not sure who is hyping what.

Some Netbook decoders may only go up to 720p IIRC, so there may be some content out there that doesn't decode well. Of course, the biggest Netbook screens are only 1280x, and most are 1024x, so there's no real reason to be doing 1080p on them as well. The Quartics and Ion are full 1080p.

I haven't had any direct involvement with this stuff, so I'm just passing on what I remember from those presentations. I think all the info (at least that I know about :)) is public.

Some random links:
http://quartics.com/QV1721.aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd568167.aspx
http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS8006033719.html

None of which I'm promising are accurate :).

[nurbs]

Of course, the biggest Netbook screens are only 1280x, and most are 1024x, so there's no real reason to be doing 1080p on them as well.
Well it's still useful if you want to watch 1080p clips. Downscaling to the screen resolution is better than not being able to watch them at all. Also some people might want to use the netbook with a projector or TV.

[benwaggoner]

Well it's still useful if you want to watch 1080p clips. Downscaling to the screen resolution is better than not being able to watch them at all. Also some people might want to use the netbook with a projector or TV.
Yep. And I think it may be the 500 that is stuck at 720p, perhaps the answer for your first question.

[nm]

Yep. And I think it may be the 500 that is stuck at 720p, perhaps the answer for your first question.
GMA 500 decodes 1080p24 according to this test (http://gwenole.beauchesne.info/en/about/blog) and some other ramblings on the web. I'd guess 1080i/p30 (at L4.1 for H.264) also works.

[7ekno]

Just use The KMPlayer (under playback options, just select the codecs to use for AVC and VC1) ...


Tek

[CruNcher]

yep best performance currently you get via VA-API :) for 1080p playback the windows stuff is still unstable (AVC), especially for XP you can only use Cyberlinks Decoder Intel provides a full Decoder package only for Vista (Demuxer,Decoder the stuff is even marked CONFIDENTIAL).
It's much harder to get the linux playback to work, especially setting up the driver (intel has bad driver support for the GMA500 currently even their own Distro Moblin lacks correct support) :P

I was able to test this on a Pico-ATX industrial system (Z510) and it's quiet amazing :) (something identical to the fitpc2)

Known Issues:
Sighting Number
Title
13757, 13560
Graphic driver may crash (with recovery) on random streams.
11910
Artifacts are seen if Deinterlacing is enabled.
12238
MPEG-2 and H.264 performance issue: Streams with high bit-rate may cause jerky playback on startup on some fragments.
13828, 13807
WMP may show corrupted picture on first seconds of some clips (H.264/MPEG-4)
13542, 13834, 14193
Audio playback may be jerky a few first seconds (on stream start-up),
14212, 14189
WMP sometimes may fail to open specific clips (need to reopen)
13540
WMP may freeze on reposition exactly to the end of specific streams (need to reposition again),
14108
Blinking line in the bottom of the picture on some VC-1 clips
13545
WMP slider is absent on first playback of specific clip
14226
WMP use Microsoft VC-1 decoder on second iteration in repeat mode on specific VC-1 clip

The Media Codecs are from 2008 though and most stuff might be fixed by now if intel would just release the new ones :P

GMA500:
- Problems on Windows Playback (Driver,Codec issues)
- Linux environment hard to setup (Driver,VA-API)
- Few 3rd Party Application support
- Own Netbook Distro lacks support (Moblin)

Ion:
+ No big Playback problems on Windows (stable)
+ Easy to setup on Linux (VDPAU,Drivers)
+ Lot 3rd Party Application support (and Driver feedback, playback issues with VP2 get fixed very fast)

GMA500 might be used a lot in Netbooks and for those who don't need fast 3D acceleration, but only media playback it might be even worth it but there are still problems that Intel needs to fix Software wise.


PROBLEM: i cannot trigger this Intel VC-1 Codec in any Media Player. Do you have an idea, how to connect this Intel VC-1 decoder (imc_vc1_dec_mf.dll) with a freeware Media-Player like MPC-HC? I hope someone here could help us (GMA500 users) to get this done and (in addition) kick some ass at the nVidia ION team If we can find a working solution/guide for this, we could not only make millions of netbook-buyers happy with full-HD playback, but also support upcoming interesting projects like www.fit-pc2.com


Thats because Microsoft decision was to make it easier for the user ;) and more secure on Win7 so you restricted to their own MF VC-1 Decoder in WMP and that has to support the GM500 and the GMA500 driver it. If you don't see lower CPU usage when playing back with WMP 12 in WIN7 VC-1 content it seems something still lacks here too :P

[buba king]

I wonder what kind of video acceleration the snapdragon based net books will have.

Personally I'm no longer interested in the extremely power hungry Atom based net books. The power consumption of the atom is very high compared to snapdragon. ARM rocks you :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snapdragon_%28processor%29

[CruNcher]

Nvidias Tegra is much more interesting as you have a all in one solution for Snapdragon you need 3rd party Hardware, but that doesn't mean it will be bad just interesting to see for which supporting decoding chips manufactures gonna decide for netbooks my top bet here Quartics :)

[benwaggoner]

I'm actually installing Win7 Ultimate RTM on a Inspiron 910 right now, if anyone's curious about what it can do for playback.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Windows 7 is so filled with win :)

Please do post your results, Ben. I'm quite interested in what the Inspiron 910 can handle regarding decoding!

What GPU does it have? A GMA950?

[benwaggoner]

Windows 7 is so filled with win :)

Please do post your results, Ben. I'm quite interested in what the Inspiron 910 can handle regarding decoding!

What GPU does it have? A GMA950?
GMA945.

http://www.wikispecs.org/index.php?title=Dell_Inspiron_Mini_9

Which appears to have only a WDM 1.0, not a WDM 1.1 driver, if I'm scouring the Intel site correctly. I'm runninng with just the stock driver Microsoft Update installed.

It plays WMV up to 1024 wide just fine, but stutters some with 720p. Decoding 1080i30 45 Mbps was about 1 fps, but it was automatically deinterlaced :).

In fact, the pervasive bob deinterlacing is quite lovely; every 30i clip I've tried gets displayed at 60p, without aliasing.