Bitperfect HD audio streaming in Vista

[rica]

Hi guys.

I got realised the only way of listening HD audio (i mean lossless flac converted from DTS-HD or THD by eac3to) is WASAPI.
Check out this thread:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=143753

The application was foobar2000 with its WASAPI plugin.
Then i started a thread here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1118204

Finally one of the frieds gave me the recipe of listening bitperfect audio; it was J River's Media Center 13.
It really works. :thanks:

Here is the test file:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/s1drfu
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

EDIT:It was edited because of the false test report

[honai]

At AVSForum you wrote:

I set Vista mixer to 16/48 so as to be sure.
When i open the mkv with any DX based players, Vista Mixer interferes.
How do i know.
Easy.
Click any system sound like vista logon sound while i'm watching the movie and i can hear the system sound. Which means mixer downconverts to 16/48.
But when i listen audio.flac (just audio unfortunetely for the time being) via Foobar2000 with its WASAPI Plugin loaded, i can not hear any system sound.

I'd question that as a premature conclusion.

The Vista mixer does operate on 32bit float when in non-exlusive mode, not 16bit or 24bit, so eventually when you mix a 24bit source (test sample) and a 16bit system sound the Vista mixer will first convert both streams to 32bit float, then mix, then convert down to the desired output bit-depth.

Also, with WASAPI I'd rather draw the conclusion that it's an exclusive mode meaning that the lack of system sound is not a matter of incompatible sample rates but rather the simple fact that foobar2000 with WASAPI blocks other applications from streaming audio, and that would include Vista system sounds.

In any case the scenario is highly unrealistic - when watching a movie with the desire of bit-perfect output, and suddenly a system sound interrupts the action, who'd care about bit-perfectness of the movie?

Another note:

Proof that Vista does support bit-perfect pass-thru is the fact that not only do you get the choice in the playback device setting dialog to indicate formats that the device "on the other side" (AVR, TV, etc.) supports, i.e. Dolby Digital, DTS, WMA, but it will actually pass-thru these formats to an AVR or TV set without any conversion.

Which establishes the proof that (a) the Vista mixer supports bit-perfect pass-thru of audio formats, and (b) just not yet bit-perfect pass-thru of HD audio formats.

Also, I believe that when you disable sound processing in that dialog (room correction etc) Vista's mixer will not even resample audio to 32bit when no other sounds are played.

[rica]

At AVSForum you wrote:



I'd question that as a premature conclusion.

Instead it's entirely possible that the system sound is actually upsampled to 24/48 if that's what is currently being played. In any case the Vista mixer does operate on 32bit float, not 16bit or 24bit, so eventually everything is being resampled at some point.

Also, with WASAPI I'd rather draw the conclusion that it's an exclusive mode meaning that the lack of system sound is not a matter of incompatible sample rates but rather the simple fact that foobar2000 with WASAPI blocks other applications from streaming audio, and that would include Vista system sounds.

Another note:

Proof that Vista does support bit-perfect is the fact that not only do you get the choice in the playback device to indicate formats that the device "on the other side" (AVR, TV, etc.) supports, i.e. Dolby Digital, DTS, WMA, but it will actually pass-thru these formats to an AVR or TV set.

Which establishes the proof that (a) the Vista mixer supports bit-perfect pass-thru of audio formats, and (b) just not yet bit-perfect pass-thru of HD audio formats.

OK then switch off all the other sounds on Vista mixer and set it to 24/96 and play my test video on MPC-HC with Madflac loaded.
And set Vista mixer to 16/48 and leave all the other sounds are opened and check the same file with MC13.
And try to see the difference of the details of the sound and compare them please.

_ _ _

[honai]

And set Vista mixer to 16/48

Not sure what you mean by that. Can you elaborate?

[rica]

Not sure what you mean by that. Can you elaborate?

Sure, even you set Vista mixer to 16/48, foobar or MC13 will passthrough mixer and give 24/96.

[honai]

I don't have a setting in the Vista mixer to set a specific bit-depth/sample rate. I go over HDMI, and I can only indicate to Vista which settings the output device supports (AVR, TV, etc).

And all of that works just fine, i.e. when the source audio is 24/96 Vista will send 24/96 to the output device, no problems. I don't see which real-world problem you are trying to solve ...

[rica]

And all of that works just fine, i.e. when the source audio is 24/96 Vista will send 24/96 to the output device, no problems. I don't see which real-world problem you are trying to solve ...

Keep living happy with your real world then :)

[GrofLuigi]

I think only Larry Osterman can answer this...

Someone should ask him, he just might answer...

GL

[rica]

I think only Larry Osterman can answer this...

Someone should ask him, he just might answer...

GL

I wish i would. :)

BTW, i think it was too late while i was testing; it doesn't work with video in DS route.
It works as Foobar2000; it means audio only.

At least there is good news from James :thanks:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15878872#post15878872

So this thread might be deleted by mods; they will decide.

Sorry for the false test report.


_ _ _ _ _

[rica]

I wish i would. :)

At least there is good news from James :thanks:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15878872#post15878872


_ _ _ _ _

Here is the good news from James:

1.8.3.7 - 25/02/2009
* New: Replaced Kernel Streaming with WASAPI exclusive (Vista SP1 and up, experimental)
* New: reduced scratching noise when starting wave playback
* Fix: working buffers could be overwritten if media format changed during playback
* Some fixes and improvements


Given it a go with flac included file using MPC-HC; it works very well.

Thanks to James again :thanks: :)

[rica]

I think everything will be more clear after this update of my post here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15770959#post15770959

_ _ _ _ _ _