x264 bitrates

[Gornot]

First of all, since most of you don't know, I am a sort of n00b when it comes to encoding files, so after a lot of searching and reading threads (not just on this forum but many others) I had NO IDEA what they were about (and couldn't figure it out even if I did :P) I have only one simple question:

For example, if I want to rip a 1h30min movie from a DVD to DivX or XviD, the standard bitrate is the one that makes the resulting file 700MB (considering that I'm using MP3 128kpbs for the audio stream).
So what should be the correct bitrate when doing the same thing with H264 (x264 :))? For a while I thought that 447kpbs video+48kpbs audio (WinAmp's MP4/aacPlus Encoder) is good enough and the resulting file is 350MB with quite a good quality, but IS IT the correct, or should I say, the "standard" bitrate... You know what I mean, the bitrate that most people use to get an exact number of files that can be archieved on a CD/DVD (just like there can be around 6 1h30min movies encoded to DivX/XviD on a single DVD).

That's all I need to know because after encoding a few movies to x264 (350MB per file) I sometimes get awful quality but sometimes it's almost perfect...

[nurbs]

There is no bitrate that will always give you good results (at a small filesize). It depends on the complexity of the video you want to encode. You should search the forum a bit. It has been discussed often.

[Gornot]

Tweaking the bitrate is no problem for me, I always do a few sample files to check the complexity and most possibler issues I can have (that I know of), I'm just wondering because I don't have enough HDD space to keep all those DVD rips and I don't want to destroy the original DVDs either...

[Blue_MiSfit]

350-700mb is pretty small if you want really good quality - for most titles anyway.

You can do a good job with x264, if you use some of the new patches and one of the high quality (slow) profiles in MeGUI. AviSynth filtering will help too... Please give your audio a little more bitrate - at least 96kbps for stereo if you're using AAC, and at least 256kbps for 5.1ch :)

~MiSfit

[neuron2]

@Gornot

Fix your thread title to adhere to rule 9 to avoid being struck. Thank you.

[Gornot]

A 48kpbs .m4a file is quite good for my taste and it doesn't take much space (if it's a ConcertDVD then I use 64kpbs, just like my AudioCD rips; works quite fine for me). Oh, yeah, I forgot to mention that for some reason MKVmerge doesn't support .aac files as input... It just gives me an error, that's why I use .m4a
There's not a single opensource software I haven't at least tried a few times and for some reason, my best satisfaction is With Real Anime 5. Maybe I should cnahge the "pattern":
First I use DVD Decrypter to decrypt the DVD, that's just fine.
But since Real Anime doesn't support VOBs as input (sometimes it works if I just change the extension to .mpg :P) I use GordianKnot to make an AVS Script and then just load that one into RA5.
I TOLD you I'm a noob hahaha

[cogman]

There is no standard bitrate. Even from 2 films of the same season of a series, you could see good results from a bitrate of 500 while seeing crappy results from that same 500.

There are ways, though, that you can get some good quality.

If quality is the most important thing to you and consistent filesize really doesn't matter all that much, then CRF is the way to go. a CRF encode will give fairly similar results at the same setting but with an unknown bitrate.

If size is very important (IE you want to fit a movie or two on a CD) then two pass is the way to go. You'll have to use a bitrate calculator to get the correct bitrate for your movie.

Here are some things you can do in either case the help improve quality.

1. Use strong settings on your encoder. This may take a longer time, but the quality will be the best for any bitrate. It is well worth it in my opinion to just use strong settings an do a slow encode.

2. Use noise filters. MVTools for AVI-synth are amazing, using them with a combination of good strong noise filters will definitely improve your quality because the encoder doesn't have to waist bits on some of the random stuff you see in a video. Again, with strong filters comes a slower encoding time.

3. consider cutting off the intro-credits of a film, this isn't easy to do, but can save you some bits in the end.

4. consider lowering the resolution. This is my least favorite of all the options, but a lower resolution film will produce better quality at a given bitrate and faster encoding speeds. However, I am of the opinion that crappy quality is better then no quality.

These are ranked in order of my preference (4 being the least preferable)

I would use x264 as my encoder as it is one of the best around (I know, we shouldn't say best, but it really is pretty darn good :D;) and some AAC encoder for the audio. Neroaac works fine.

But you should certainly give strong settings a shot. x264 is a miracle worker with good strong settings. Make sure you have the latest version of it, as they update it quite often (you can see a download for it at the top of this forum)

[Gornot]

Thanks a lot cogman, that was pretty darn useful.
Yes, the filesize is of a great matter to me because after ripping my DVDs I want to archive them on new DVDs, thus keeping the originals intact (I have quite an impressive collection of war movies, for example).
But yeah, good quality is also important to me, too, so, yeah, I just downloaded MeGUI for the 50th time and I'm trying to get the best result possible. You bet that ?ll try MVTools, too... It just takes a lot of my free time for these encodings (and I have very little free time) but I'll definetly give it a try.
Thanks a lot, guys.

[neuron2]

You've ignored my request so struck.

[Gornot]

Dude, I didn't see, really... After Blue_MiSfit's post I posted and READ my post throughoutly and your post wasn't there... dammit

[cogman]

Thanks a lot cogman, that was pretty darn useful.
Yes, the filesize is of a great matter to me because after ripping my DVDs I want to archive them on new DVDs, thus keeping the originals intact (I have quite an impressive collection of war movies, for example).
But yeah, good quality is also important to me, too, so, yeah, I just downloaded MeGUI for the 50th time and I'm trying to get the best result possible. You bet that ?ll try MVTools, too... It just takes a lot of my free time for these encodings (and I have very little free time) but I'll definetly give it a try.
Thanks a lot, guys.

lol, re-read your post and I misunderstood it. Luckly, you don't have to be around for the entire encode with Me-Gui.

One tip I would suggest is that you encode short clips using the clip feature of me-gui (like 10 seconds) Trust me, when playing with settings it is worth it. Once you get the settings you like use them on the full video.

[Comatose]

I find XviD DVD rips @ 700MB with MP3 audio, even at "scene standard" resolutions pretty lacking. 700MB sounds like it could yield very decent quality with x264, but the only way to know is to check. I wouldn't drop to 350MB for a movie.

[Gornot]

One tip I would suggest is that you encode short clips using the clip feature of me-gui (like 10 seconds) Trust me, when playing with settings it is worth it. Once you get the settings you like use them on the full video.

Are you trying to tell me that some people DON'T do it like that? LOL!

[cogman]

Are you trying to tell me that some people DON'T do it like that? LOL!

Yep, I didn't to start out with :D, this would have saved me so much time :D

[Octo-puss]

Personally I would never go back to 700MB rips again, EVER. Some of the old movies I downloaded few years ago are just totally terrible. At least compared to 1400MB encoded with x264. that being an average 1h30 movie.

[Gornot]

Yeah, I know what you mean, and that's exactly why I don't download movies anymore (it's been about three years :P). I got a job just so I can buy all the movies I want. Also, I have a friend with a huge collection of some very good, very OLD movies, so I'm also thinking of "digitally remastering" those old, partially worn-out VHSs to x264 :)

Thanks a lot, everybody, you're the best :D