KMPlayer has fixed all my playback issues. Let's discuss it here!

[neoufo51]

Allow me to explain how I went from player to player:

First, I started with Zoomplayer. Not enough features, needed all sorts of addons.

Second, I went to Mplayer with MPUI. It worked extremely well with the majority of my videos, but was missing a lot of advanced features and would be too slow in playing back high definition video like apple trailers and the like.

Third, I tried MPC-HC up until today. All my previous issues were gone and playback was speedy on most of the video I play. However, DVD playback was sloooowww, the Haali Renderer would not work with it too well and went out of sync frequently, along with residual desktop showing up most of the time, and switching to VMR9 or Overlay would lead me to a washed out picture.

Finally, a reader here PMed me and told me that KMPlayer had a major codec update today and that he'd never had such good playback before with any other player. I tried it out and put it through all the tests:

Haali Renderer works great with none of the weaknesses that MPC-HC had, VMR9 has a "force RGB32" option so I can use that if I wanted true blacks and VMR playback, all my high definition material plays back perfectly, and DVD playback is as smooth as can be!

This is now my full time player! Anybody else find this to be their best option?

[Dark Shikari]

Second, I went to Mplayer with MPUI. It worked extremely well with the majority of my videos, but was missing a lot of advanced features and would be too slow in playing back high definition video like apple trailers and the like.KMplayer is just a frontend for mplayer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KMPlayer).

[ranpha]

KMplayer is just a frontend for mplayer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KMPlayer).

I think he refers to the Windows software available at http://www.kmplayer.com/, not the more illustrious MPlayer front-end for KDE desktop environment.

My comments about KMPlayer, the weakness first.

- The Haali Renderer in this player is the same as the one in MPC-HC. Still have the ATI ghost-lines if you do not upscale. And I do not have problems with HR in MPC-HC ins general apart from that.
- The player by itself is bloated and slow, takes longer to load. Plus opening a single file can take up to 4-5 seconds while opening the same file in MPC is almost instantaneous.
- DXVA compatibility is not as good. For example, it is highly possible that a video that plays well with MPC-HC in DXVA mode using the Cyberlink decoder and EVR custom presenter will not play in KMPlayer, even with the same codec and the same renderer.
- Some default settings in the KMPlayer isn't acceptable, such as the External Subtitle Module not being enabled by default. This player can take some time to set up too.

The good thing about the KMPlayer.
- The subtitle engine. It is just as fast as the ffdshow subtitle filter, very sharp without needing to upscale the video to monitor's native resolution, thus making the subs looks very good. No rendering problems with complex subs either. Plus, the subtitle engine works with almost all video renderers, even overlay and VMR 7/9 windowed. Sadly, did not work with vanilla EVR, which is a minor annoyance.
- The video renderers choices. The are more of them here, and the VMR7/9 renderless in KMPlayer is superior than the one in MPC-HC.

[sheppaul]

I don't think it's the best option to have. It depends on your needs and playback environments. Though it has a well designed layout, it still lacks some features I need. And it looks like a little bloated.

[neoufo51]

I don't think it's the best option to have. It depends on your needs and playback environments. Though it has a well designed layout, it still lacks some features I need. And it looks like a little bloated.
Which player satisfies your needs?

@Ranpha, thanks for clarifying that for Dark.

[stax76]

Impressive work but the startup time is insane and what's worse is it violates the GPL using Gabest's work.

[petran79]

Finally, a reader here PMed me and told me that KMPlayer had a major codec update today and that he'd never had such good playback before with any other player. I tried it out and put it through all the tests:




there isnt an updated version. it was a mistake and the download link redirects to the previous version

http://www.kmplayer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10068

Impressive work but the startup time is insane and what's worse is it violates the GPL using Gabest's work.


they are trying to correct the GPL issue

http://www.kmplayer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1182

also the main debate can be read here:

http://www.kmplayer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140


I too use KMPlayer. MPC is good too but since it opens files based on ffdshow sometime the application hangs. Zoomplayer and any ffdshow based player does the same. Especially if I run DSP plugins.

It is not as fast as the other MPlayer based players and ffdshow ones and the interface is clumsier than MPC and subtitle support lacks too but it offers more features.

It seems to me the most balanced media player. But still for HD video MPC is the best option

[sheppaul]

Gabest's libraries are just bundled with the package. That could be the problem? I've heard the core part of the player was written by delphi from scratch. ps. I think they should drop every gpl library if they want to aviod the violation.


@neoufo, if the filters are properly installed and tweaked, everything you've said should be possible with other combinations. Haali's renderer is not shipped with the package.

[clsid]

Translating things into another language doesn't avoid copyright violations, in this case the GPL.

[stax76]

Even if there is or would be no GPL violation it is still very bad displaying the filter as KMP Filter instead of using the original filter name.

[Placio74]

... it is still very bad displaying the filter as KMP Filter instead of using the original filter name.
I'm don't see... Where?
When used Gabest filters - it's displayed (example (MPEG2) Gabest MPEG Video Deocder for MPEG2).
When used internal (libs from FFmpeg project) - it's displayed (example (FLV4) KMP Video Codec(Flash Video4-libcodec.dll).

[stax76]

Sorry, didn't notice it uses mostly libavcodec, I thought for instance it used MPV Decoder from Gabest.

[Placio74]

Sorry, didn't notice it uses mostly libavcodec, I thought for instance it used MPV Decoder from Gabest.
Where?
I'm still see KMP display (MPEG2) Gabest MPEG Video Deocder for MPEG2) when used Mpeg2DecFilter.ax - not "as KMP Filter".
:confused:

[sheppaul]

Translating things into another language doesn't avoid copyright violations, in this case the GPL.
If you have a small experience with programming between languages, you'll know that could not be done that way. Reviewing and understanding the codes written by others are very difficult to make it working without problems as well as to keep it working by patching. Strictly speaking, it is almost impossible to do so if the source codes working without problems are not copied entirely. Furthermore, It is hard to think the player is the result of the translation to delphi considering the complexity of the program and the periond of development. Have a close look into the player before making an assumption. I don't see much similarities with MPC. Actually I've used it for years. It is a big mammal.

PS. The openning delay and poor EVR supports in vista are one of the main obstacle for me to use the player. Otherwise it works vey well in xp environment.

[clsid]

I did see a lot of similarities when I tried KMP long ago. Some very specific bugs that used to be present in MPC were also present in KMP. I don't remember the exact details and I can't be bothered to look them up.

[sheppaul]

I think you should be more specfic.

[LoRd_MuldeR]

See this:
http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?forum_id=462894

Also note that even if they did not take the entire MPC code, it's still quite possible that they took portions out of it and merged them with their own code...

[sheppaul]

it's still quite possible that they took portions out of it and merged them with their own code.
I know the statement. According to the link, gabest couldn't find a clear evidence except for the similarities of the user interfaces. That couldn't be the reason of accusation. He did a memory dump to find mpc codes within KMP but couldn't. Do you have any proof for your assumption?

[stax76]

I think loading a GPL module is a GPL violation if the GPL module don't explicitly allow it, read here (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLPluginsInNF).

[sheppaul]

I think loading a GPL module is a GPL violation if the GPL module don't explicitly allow it, read here (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLPluginsInNF).

I think they should drop every gpl library if they want to aviod the violation.
That's a distribution problem. Isn't it? The gpl libraries are not necessary to run the player afaik. It's basically a directshow player with libavcodec plugined. Therefore, the libraries can be dropped if it violates any licenses including gpl.

ps. libavcodec is LGPL. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libavcodec)

[stax76]

No, as I understand you are not allowed to make function calls into GPL modules.

[sheppaul]

Even if it has the plugin interface? What about the many winamp plugins using GPL modules?

[stax76]

just read the FQA:


If the program dynamically links plug-ins, and they make function calls to each other and share data structures, we believe they form a single program, which must be treated as an extension of both the main program and the plug-ins. This means that combination of the GPL-covered plug-in with the non-free main program would violate the GPL. However, you can resolve that legal problem by adding an exception to your plug-in's license, giving permission to link it with the non-free main program.

[LoRd_MuldeR]

Instead of loading the GPL'd code as a library, you could also run it as a "standalone" executable.
Running a GPL'd executable (e.g. a CLI program) from a None-GPL executable should okay.
Since both programs will run as independent processes, this won't violate the GPL license terms...

[sheppaul]

It means the hard-coded text part should be removed from the product but I can't understand it well. Let me think about it. The gabest filters included in the player can be registered to the system and any player can use it through directshow. It's a kind of plugin too. KMP can do it without registering the filters. That is the only one difference I can discern.

[LoRd_MuldeR]

If the author of a DirectShow filter released it as a standalone filter, that is an AX file, then it was obviously intended to be "loaded" by other applications. GPL'd or not.
But if a filter was released as an internal filter of a GPL application, then making it an external filter and loading it in a None-GPL application would be highly questionable!

[sheppaul]

Hmm, so it means directshow filters using gpl libraries are not compatible to GPL when it is loaded into none-gpled application?

[stax76]

What about non dshow GPL libs like libdts?

[sheppaul]

I've already said that the infringing part should be removed. :)

ps. Or it can be released as a standalone directshow filter if it does not violate GPL.

[neoufo51]

Impressive work but the startup time is insane and what's worse is it violates the GPL using Gabest's work.
The startup time is not nearly as good as MPC-HC but considering that all my playback issues have been fixed, I can wait the extra couple of seconds. I've had zero complaints with KMPlayer while MPC gives me trouble every so often.

I don't need all the features that KMPlayer has so if MPC-HC fixes the majority of its playback issues to give a much more robust playback experience, I'll switch back.

[clsid]

Some of gabest's work is also inside the player itself, not just in the filters.

[sheppaul]

Can you be more specific if you know something about that? Don't say it's something like translation.

[neoufo51]

Can you be more specific if you know something about that? Don't say it's something like translation.
I'd like to know too.

[wata]

i been using KMPlayer since 2years ago, i think it is the best player currently.
before that i use mpc/zoomplayer