Few x264 Encoding Questions

[Seraphic-]

Hi,

What inloop filter setting would be suggested for 480p/720p (59.94FPS) console game-play (3d rendered graphics - fast motion)? Also, I was thinking of using HQ-Slowest as a base (would HQ-Insane be worth the extra encode time?).

Also, can you ever use too high of a bit-rate?
Is 10,000 for 480p/720p too much or is more always better if you can deal with the extra file size?

Thanks

[LoRd_MuldeR]

Also, can you ever use too high of a bit-rate?
At some point you won't see the difference with your eyes. So you'll waste bitrate (disk space) for no visual benefit.

[foxyshadis]

Hi,

What inloop filter setting would be suggested for 480p/720p (59.94FPS) console game-play (3d rendered graphics - fast motion)?
This is completely dependent on your taste in sharpness vs blockiness.

Also, I was thinking of using HQ-Slowest as a base (would HQ-Insane be worth the extra encode time?).
Not really. However, there are settings even beyond HQ-Insane (--me-prepass and --fgo are experimental patches, --me tesa is just newer than the profile) that can make a larger noticeable difference at low to moderate bitrates than 16 reference frames. But they will drop your speed pretty cruelly and definitely deserve the insane moniker.

Also, can you ever use too high of a bit-rate?

The higher the bitrate the faster the settings you can use to get the same quality. If you raise your bitrate high enough even a realtime encoding can look great. Find a crf value you like and stick to it, though, if you have no bitrate restrictions. It'll save you from using much too high or too low bitrates and having to re-encode.

[fibbingbear]

To clarify foxyshadis, use negative numbers in the inloop filter if you want sharpness, positive numbers if you want blockiness. From my understanding, if it's more simplistic like anime/animation, you generally want positive numbers --- if it's realistically rendered (this also includes computer animation), you typically want 0/0 or even negative numbers. It is a matter of preference, though. I use -2/-1 for realistic footage, simply because it's the default used by MeGUI. For anime I typically increase it to 1/1.


To clarify Lord_Mulder: he's right, except there is one reason why you might want to go overkill with the encoding. If you plan to do any transcoding later, you'll be able to do better transcodes with very bit-intensive footage. I know everyone looks down on transcoding, and avoid it when you can, but sometimes it's just inevitable.



One thing to keep in mind with console gameplay --- 10 years from now, it will probably be MUCH harder to go back and get that exact same gameplay. If you're going to record and plan to keep it for a considerable amount of time (i.e., not throw it away), I recommend going for a higher than normal bitrate/lower than normal CRF encoding.

[Shinigami-Sama]

to give you an idea of the 'normal' crf settings
18-22 are what most people aim for, unless its a touhou game, then well... break out the terabyte drive :P

[desta]

To clarify foxyshadis, use negative numbers in the inloop filter if you want sharpness, positive numbers if you want blockiness.
You sure it's not more like use negative numbers if you want sharpness at the risk of some blockiness, and positive numbers if you want softness but less chance of blockiness...?

[Dark Shikari]

To clarify foxyshadis, use negative numbers in the inloop filter if you want sharpness, positive numbers if you want blockinessUh, what?!

No, you use negative numbers if you want sharpness at the cost of heavy blockiness, and positive numbers if you prefer blurring to blocking.

0:0 is fine for most content. Most blocking problems with x264 are caused by people using overly low deblocking settings for no good reason.

[fibbingbear]

Uh, what?!

No, you use negative numbers if you want sharpness at the cost of heavy blockiness, and positive numbers if you prefer blurring to blocking.

0:0 is fine for most content. Most blocking problems with x264 are caused by people using overly low deblocking settings for no good reason.

ha ha, I sure did goof with that explanation! :-p

You are right, dark shikari and desta --- I should have written "blurring" instead of "blocking"

[MetallMann]

maybe a little off topic ....

How much bitrate should I use for 1080p encoding (-> approximate nubers) to get HQ results???

TNX

[LoRd_MuldeR]

maybe a little off topic ....

How much bitrate should I use for 1080p encoding (-> approximate nubers) to get HQ results???

TNX

As always: This totally depends on the contents (complexity) of the individual source video :rolleyes:

Furthermore it depends on the other encoder settings:
1. By using "slow" settings you can squish out much more quality at the same bitrate.
2. Raising the bitrate enough will give good quality, even at very "fast" settings.

If you are targeting for a certain level of quality (not a specific target bitrate/filesize), then use CRF mode!

[MetallMann]

tnx for such quick reply....

Are there not any "general" numbers ... I mean for 1080p there should be at least 2x more bitrate beacouse there is 2.25x more data to present (in linear terms)....
I noticed that 720p encoded files have "generally average" bitrate about 5Mbit +/- 1Mbit/s... (really generally speaking)... so there should be at least 10Mbit of bandwidth.

I know there are exceptions .... but at least generally there should be some limits (IE: for 1080p -> 10Mbit +/- 2Mbit)???


I had encoded (not so long ago) one film (the 6th day) in 1080p (x264). The strange thing was (and it still is ;D) that the movie had just about 3Mbit!!! of bitrate (without audio), which is kinda strange... There really are a lot of dark scenes in it but such a deviation from other movies I encoded which were all about 8Mbit???

The most funny thing is I don´t see (or my monitor doesn´t show them) any "bad" or "loosy" degredations.


Thanks for reply

[foxyshadis]

And you just answered your own question.

If you want to find a general bitrate range for whatever is an acceptable quality to you, encode a dozen or so movies with the crf you like best. But then, if you're going to go that far, why not just use crf?

Then ask yourself: Why do you even care about the bitrate? If you have to fit it onto something (like a DVD), then you already know what bitrate you have to use, since you should be using a bitrate calculator. If you don't, then you shouldn't care about bitrate at all! How something looks means far more than an arbitrary number like bitrate, and crf dictates how something looks, bitrate is only a side effect.