Trying to get PowerDVD to interacti with Dshow and file extensions

[CruNcher]

As you can see i try to get the most out of PowerDVD @ the moment and i keep you updated about this. The Player actually has a Dshow interface via CLDShowX.dll with the Player it's even possible to save Screenshots for any Accellerated Codec like VC-1, Mpeg-2 or H.264 directly out of the player (it actually stops the Accelleration on the Fly as soon as you click on the Screenshot button, tested with Interlaced stuff and it saved the Interlaced result not the Motion Adaptive Deinterlaced final the G92 showed on Screen, but how does it render Subtitles and Menus without stoping the Accelleration and without glueing them to the Video hmmm ???).
It can interact with Haalis Media Splitter when installed but it should be avoided especialy with .MP4 as it's internal Parser is better (compatible) for its own Decoder (else it can happen that you get black screens or wrong playback with it, for content that's useing the .MP4 container). Next im gonna try to get .mkv working with Haalis or Gabest Splitter :) it should work even subtitles should work accellerated, but im not quiet sure if this wouldn't need a little more effort and the PowerDVD source ;).
If you don't wan't that it phones home just remove Evoparser.dll <---- it's been used for all the Webstuff in the Player, actually you can remove alot of stuff as it's buildup very modular and lower it's memory usage that way if you want :). It is the Player that comes the closest to become a All in One Full Hardware Accellerated Player (in combination with ATIs and Nvidias Hardware Decoding capabilities) under Windows with a little work here and there so it suprises me that this isn't done by the Cyberlink guys themselves :)

[unskinnyboy]

Couldn't finish reading your spiel. I must say that for such an experienced member, your constant refusal to use punctuation marks is appalling. I wanted to read and understand, but couldn't.

[CruNcher]

Done, sorry but i write most of the times as i speak so without thinking about punctuation, im really gonna try to avoid this style of writing in the future or correct it afterwards.

[CruNcher]

Ok some updates , i looked more in the interoperability and Playback of .mp4 and .mov (the mother format of mp4) and i found out some i think rather strange things at least for Cyberlinks Parser/Decoder.
For example Nero Digital .MP4 HD Trailers The Greatest Game Ever Played and Waiting Game both .mp4 didn't played correctly with Cyberlinks Decoder in PowerDVD (corrupted sound, strange playback speed as timestamps are parsed incorrectly ???).
Installing Haalis Splitter and they Played ok even with Hardware accelleration (therfore some other .MP4 didn't Played anymore that worked before with Cyberlinks Framework those files where Mp4Box muxed either Beta,Alpha or SVN versions), the strange thing is now renaming both of those Nero .mp4 to .mov and the files played fine with Cyberlinks Framework ??? (are those Nero HD Muxed files more MOV based then MP4 ???). Then i tried the reverse thing i renamed Apple Quicktime Trailers that are .mov into .mp4 and Cyberlinks Framework refused to play them (seems to be very strict about the Decission what is a .MP4 and what is a .MOV in a Standard term i would say this is correct behaviour of their Parser) with Haalis Splitter in PowerDVD they played flawless.
But Haali refused to play those Mp4Box Muxed files (alot of them) with PowerDVDs Decoder also my lowcomplexity-highpro-test.mp4 is under those files that plays fine with Cyberlinks Framework but not with Haalis Splitter in combination with Cyberlinks Decoder and Hardware Accelleration.

So from all this i came to the conclusion that Haalis Splitter might be actually more compatible with alot of different files and Cyberlinks Decoder, except some revisions of (what seems to be buggy non standard complaint) Mp4box muxed files (that actually play without problems in Mplayer and VLC another strange thing) to try to find out if that's the the case im gona remux all of the non working .mp4 files with a new version of Mp4box,Mp4creator and Mainconcept Xmuxer and see what the results are then with both Cyberlinks Framework, Haalis Splitter and Cyberlinks Decoder.
This problems could add up to .mkv too because they are remuxed with mkvmerge from a .mp4 file and if there is for example some timestamp problem im quiet sure this could very well get into the final .mkv alike and couse playback problems (black screens at least).

Im not quiet sure wich behaviour is correct here either Cyberlinks or Haalis it's hard to say yet (From a strict Standard Point of View Cyberlinks behaviour seems more correct especialy if Nero Digital Muxed files are really more MOV files then actually MP4 files and is/was this a bug in Neros (Atemes) Muxer or wanted behaviour ???).

To test this yourselves get this 2 TheGreatestGame_HD_AVC.mp4 and WG30secSpot_AVC_HDTV.mp4 NeroDigital HD files from http://trailer.nerodigital.com and playback them in PowerDVD without Haalis Mp4 splitter active you will see that they playback wrong and even crash the Player and after you rename them into .mov everything is fine hehe (makes no difference with Hardware accellleration enabled/disabled).

Im almost sure even if that sounds Harsh that what happens here is not really a bug but (forced) wanted non interoperability and i have to say that should not be what a Standard gets developed for in the End, but i also know since the years that Interoperability isn't really a thing any of those Companies really want's they want to bind you to their Product (License you nonsense and their Logo) and Content and this is a really really sad thing, especialy for the Customer and i don't understand how Developers can play in this Game :(

Ok i found out why lowcomplexity-highpro-test.mp4 plays with PowerDVDs Framework Hardware Accellerated and why not with Haalis Splitter it's very easy explained PowerDVDs .MP4 Parser ignores the Profile Level but Haalis Splitter doesn't it gives that information to PowerDVDs Decoder so the Result is a Black Screen when the Level isn't 4.1 in this case it was 5.1 and so the file didn't played (case solved).

[bond]

some directshow players decode mov files through quicktime instead of directshow. this propably explains the playback differences

[sillKotscha]

some directshow players decode mov files through quicktime instead of directshow.

as MPC does by default... and for old mov files this even guarantees a higher (?), well, in any case a better compatibility/ chance to play some weired files.

[CruNcher]

some directshow players decode mov files through quicktime instead of directshow. this propably explains the playback differences

It's a nice theory and indeed could be right (alot of Video software actually does it that way) if Quicktime would be installed ;) so no it's definately another parser that get used to playback those renamed .mp4->.mov files and that should be Cyberlinks and then Nero Digital Streams work flawless but only then or with Haalis Splitter installed, and imho this is strange.

[mediator]

Im not quiet sure wich behaviour is correct here either Cyberlinks or Haalis it's hard to say yet (From a strict Standard Point of View Cyberlinks behaviour seems more correct especialy if Nero Digital Muxed files are really more MOV files then actually MP4 files and is/was this a bug in Neros (Atemes) Muxer or wanted behaviour ???).

while I cannot say why Cyberlink has problems with Nero files, I can assure that Nero files are created according to ISO. Nero files are not "more" MOV files then other ISO-MP4 files. The playback issues therefore must be a "SEP" (Somebody Else's Problem) ;)

[CruNcher]

while I cannot say why Cyberlink has problems with Nero files, I can assure that Nero files are created according to ISO. Nero files are not "more" MOV files then other ISO-MP4 files. The playback issues therefore must be a "SEP" (Somebody Else's Problem) ;)

I see, so then it seems to be a bug caused by Cyberlinks Framework lets wait and see if that's fixed in the next version, anyway could you please check this here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=133217 i still have those non Hardware Accelleration problems with Showtime HD-DVD and Blu-Ray content. AVC, Mpeg-2 and VC-1 alone get accellerated but if playing HD-DVD or Blu-Ray they don't and somehow it seems to have todo something with Subtitle on those Medias (it seems as soon as Showtime detects Subtitles are available it stops Hardware Accelleration or actually never starts it then) or bad PureVideo 2 (BSP/VP2) implementation.

[mediator]

i still have those non Hardware Accelleration problems with Showtime HD-DVD and Blu-Ray content. AVC, Mpeg-2 and VC-1 alone get accellerated but if playing HD-DVD or Blu-Ray they don't

We are already looking into this and I hope we can provide some feedback soon.

[mediator]

@Cruncher:

In our tests, we found no problem with the combination of HWA and HDDVD/BluRay disc menus. Can you please also confirm that you are using Nero 8.2 as from December 2007?

We found a problem which is related to recent nVidia driver changes, but it only affects VC-1 HWA

So, can you please confirm (again): that AVC _and_ VC-1 _and_ MPEG-2 get hardware accelerated when played from a file, but all not when played from BD/HDDVD?

PS: Maybe this issue would deserve a dedicated thread!?

[CruNcher]

@Cruncher:

In our tests, we found no problem with the combination of HWA and HDDVD/BluRay disc menus. Can you please also confirm that you are using Nero 8.2 as from December 2007?

We found a problem which is related to recent nVidia driver changes, but it only affects VC-1 HWA

So, can you please confirm (again): that AVC _and_ VC-1 _and_ MPEG-2 get hardware accelerated when played from a file, but all not when played from BD/HDDVD?

PS: Maybe this issue would deserve a dedicated thread!?

Yes sorry i was wrong i rechecked it and indeed it's fine with Blu-Ray Mpeg-2 and HD-DVD AVC the only problem i see now might be the VC-1 you mentioned, if i start a HD-DVD VC-1 Kernel and CPU Usage Win XP SP2 are way to high (especialy Kernel) (8800 GT Forceware 169.21 WHQL).
Also the Nero Vision 5 Mini HD-DVD with the 3d Menu now works as it should (correctly Deinterlaced) jesus whats up with me (other programms that where running must have coused a conflict here) im really sorry for this false claims. This pushes Showtime now on top of all Players as it has much better file Playing support :)

Geez i don't understand this behaviour of Showtime really it's behind my sense of logic now HDD files aren't accellerated it uses Video Renderer instead of The Video Mixing Renderer 9 for HDD files now (drag and drop) what is this for a Player Design try to interact with Dshow a little more logic and normaly this means if someone activates Hardware accelleration in the Player don't allow any other Video Renderer then the Video Mixing Renderer 9 XP and EVR Vista (for DVD,HD-DVD and Blu-Ray it works that way), it's so easy (or allow the user to chose the prefered renderer like Mplayer Classic does) :D


If some guy from Nero reads this, please allow lower Bitrates then 15 Mbit as custom bitrates and a Advanced Encoder Config for Mini HD-DVD, those lower bitrate stuff should work everywhere the 3D intro stuff is also Lower Bitrate and works, and why is DDPlus Audio only used when useing the 3D Menu stuff and else not even selectable ?

Would be nice if Nero planned something like this or would take it as an improvement note, also a compatible H.264 bitstream import function (smart rendering) would be nice ;)
Ahh and how about a nice Mouse Navigation for HD-DVDs (Keyboard Navigation works nice tough) :)