IVTC and Deinterlacing...

[TheArkive]

First off I use AGK. I have a movie that I'm trying to compress. (Movie title is "She Creature".) I'm keeping the original AC3 audio (5.1 surround sound).

There seems to be 2 different types of video in the same stream. In the beginning of the video, when it introduces the "video logo" of the movie producer, that seems to be the first type, and the rest of the movie is the 2nd type.

I've tried all 3 combnations. Normal encoding, Force Film, and Deinterlace. Basically:

- 1 of the 3 AVI's has a really good smooth intro, and the movie is a bit jerky.
- another 1 of the 3 has a really jerky intro and a really smooth movie
- the last of the 3 has a half-way-decent intro, and still a good quality movie.

Anyone else run into this before? I'm thinking that I might have to join the VOB's into one file or something, split the intro from the movie, and use AGK on each of them seperately, then join them. :(

I'm hoping to avoid this. If I can't avoid it, does anyone know of an AVI joiner that can keep 5.1 AC3? I tried "AVI Splitter v2.11", thinking that I could just use the AVIs that I have, but it doesn't seem to support 5.1 AC3 or something... ...so needless to say I didn't bother trying to get as far as joining at that point, because the splitter downmixed to stereo. I have VideoRedo (great program) but it won't do AVIs.

Any ideas? Thanks in advance for any help.

[manono]

Hello and welcome to the forum,

Anyone else run into this before?

Yes, it's not all that uncommon to have an intro at 29.97fps and the main movie at 23.976fps. Since the logo takes up only a very small part of the video length, I'd either put up with jerkiness in it, or cut it out altogether.

By the way, how did you decrypt the DVD? Did you use DVD Decrypter in IFO Mode? The reason I ask is that if this logo is really part of the movie, then it should be at the same framerate. If you use the default File Mode, the logo may be in a different PGC and not meant to be part of the movie.

Movies shouldn't be deinterlaced.

If you encode them both at their respective framerates, you won't be able to join the AVIs later. AVI requires the same framerate all the way through. Sort of. If both videos have the same attributes, VDub(Mod) can join them.

[TheArkive]

Thanks for the welcome. Glad to join you guys! :D

Yeah I used DVD Decrypter, and I did it in IFO mode. This was the first movie that I kept several subtitles in several languages (like 7 or so). Would that have anything to do with it? I doubt it does, but it did cross my mind as a possibility.

As far as I can recall, it was in the same PGC. I know that in IFO mode, you only end up doing one PCG at a time, so yah, it is technicaly part of the movie.

One funny note, is that even the original movie has jerky moments. I read the original rip several times with Media Player Classic just to check, and the movie was actually somewhat jerky, ...and the intro nice and smooth... it was kinda weird. I'm glad AGK can fix that though. If I were to use WinDVD or something, it probably would have been nice and smooth, I've had that happen before with some other movie rips when reading them from the harddrive.

Is it possible to convert a certain frame rate to another with minimal effects? Would VDub(Mod) do that?

[manono]

Hi-

If you'd like to upload somewhere a 5-10 second piece of the movie, a portion with motion, we can have a look and give better advice. There are certain kinds of DVDs that all AutoGK can do is deinterlace, which isn't optimal.

OK, if you used IFO Mode, then you did right. It's possible, I suppose, that the logo could have been added later, and could be at a different framerate.

Is it possible to convert a certain frame rate to another with minimal effects? Would VDub(Mod) do that?

If you change the framerate, then the audio goes out of synch, unless you then also adjust that. But it's easy to change the framerate of the video. Open the AVI in VDubMod and set Video for Direct Stream Copy. Then go Video->Frame Rate->Change To xx.xxx Frames Per second. Then File->Save As, and give it a new name.

[TheArkive]

Thanks man, :D ... I'm giving it a shot now.

I'll report back the stuff I'll try and how well it worked. :)

[TheArkive]

Well... :mad:

It seems that the credits are a different framerate also. After reading that IVTC and Deinterlacing tutorial (I did that before I even started this post)... I have been drawing all kinds of conclusions and making connections about how this stuff really works... and thus realizing my limited options here :rolleyes:

Here is what I've tried and the results:

- I joined all the VOBs and split them. So I have a clip of the intro and a clip of the movie.

- Did the movie, watched the whole thing. A very, very minor blip here and there with the framerate, but nothing worth freakin over. Probably the result of buffering or crappy TC'ing is my guess. It seems that the credits are a different framerate as well (some form of true 29.97).

They are not the least bit smooth as they scroll up, just like the the intro when it plays (once again, this is referring to after encoding through AGK).

- I tried AGK with the intro, and used CTRL+F9 and set the .fps option to 23.976 fps. It was able to finish, but as I feared, it was still jerky. ... I don't suppose there is a way to convert a true 29.97 fps video clip into 23.976 fps without being able to notice a difference eh?

Or maybe to use a media player that is able to buffer really good, so I can keep everything as separate clips, but still not notice a difference when the clips change over to the next one? :p

- I've settled for (at the moment) keeping the intro and movie seperate, and as for the credits, I still donno.

In the middle of writing this reply I tried playing the original DVD rip with WinDVD 8. The intro and the credits are very nice and smooth. In this original, most of the movie is quite smooth, but there are moments when I can see "phasing" (I don't know what else to call it). It's like the image is overlayed over itself, but they are not in the same position; one lags behind the other. And to add to the weirdness, it is not a consistent lag, about ever half second it seems to cycle, but only when the entire screen is panning. My guess is poor TC'ing. (I base that on what I read in the IVTC and Deinterlacing tutorial.)

:mad:

It seems that I really can't have the best of both worlds. :( Quality seems to improve after transcoding and IVTC'ing, but if I cut the file up, and try to play it as a playlist with separate files (intro, movie, and credits) then I get blips in the audio because the audio bleeds over from intro to movie, and from movie to credits. If I could mix a 5.1 multi-channel AC3 in soundforge or something I could fade out the audio between the intro and the movie, but between movie and credits, the audio is consistent and can't be mixed for fading. LOL so even if I could do the first part it would hardly be worth it.

Unfortunately I'm a stickler for quality, so I admit I am being a little picky with the quality, especially seeing as I have issues with even the original DVD quality. Is there any way to resolve these quality issues? Or is my best bet just to stick with 29.97 FPS and get over the crappy TC'ing?

Edit: BTW, I don't expect to get a "one-click-fixes-all" solution here. If this is possible to fix, and if you can point me to the correct tutorials, I would be most grateful :D

[manono]

Hi-

Yes, hybrids are a bitch. The AVI container requires the same framerate. Other containers allow for Variable Frame Rate (VFR) encoding, and could handle what you have. There are several solutions, but a couple might be beyond your level of AviSynth expertise. Of course, you'll have to do these things manually, and outside of AutoGK. Each of the 3 solutions presented here will encode the 29.97fps parts for 23.976fps for joining with the main movie.

One would be this:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=110093&highlight=60ito24p

Slightly easier would be this:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=613994&highlight=convert60ito24p#post613994

And easiest of all is AviSynth's ConvertFPS:

LeakKernelDeint(Order=1)#if TFF
ConvertToYUY2()
ConvertFPS(23.976)
ConvertToYV12()

And that will just blend the heck out of it, but it should play fairly smoothly.

http://avisynth.org/index.php?page=FPS