Good video card with HDMI out

[OEG]

I am looking into a possible media center to connect to a true HD capable monitor/TV (1920 x 1080 native resolution) in the near future.

One should use a video card with HDMI out I suppose.
Here are a few cards I found with a good supplier here in the Netherlands:
nVidia chipset:
http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/vga/vga/pro_vga_detail.php?UID=788, at around Euro 80.
http://www.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=2&l2=6&l3=271&model=1175&modelmenu=2, at around Euro 155
ATI chipset:
http://www.asus.com/products4.aspx?l1=2&l2=8&l3=241&model=1313&modelmenu=1, at Euro 120 and likewise
http://www.sapphiretech.com/en/products/graphics_specifications.php?gpid=145, a clone of the ASUS.

I prefer the MSI card since it is passively cooled, the graphics performance should be more than enough for media center use (browsing, watching photos, simple games, etc.)
Alas, the MSI card is DVI-I (single link) only, which perhaps limits the capabality to use the full 1920 x 1080 on the DVI computer output.
Unfortunately, the ASUS card doesn't have a DVI connector, only VGA.
Is it actually capable of displaying the desktop etc. using the HDMI or is HDMI reserved for media-out only? They mention a HDMI to DVI-D accessory cable on the web page.
Both cards seem to be lacking in hardware H264 decoding capacity.

The choice is rather limited, perhaps one should wait a little more to see if more and better cards appear when Vista takes on?

In the meantime, please share your opinions and user experiences with any of the above cards and HTPC use in general.

Thanks.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Indeed :) I'd say wait until HDMI ports become standard fare, and use component out for now. Nothing wrong with it.

~MiSfit

[OEG]

Is component out allowed by spec of HD content protection?

Also, it seems to me most commercially available HTPC's overhere are completely ignoring HDTV. Windows XP MCE doesn't even recognize DVB-S and DVB-T natively nor HD discs in either standard. Most are designed not very cleverly regarding energy consumption, thermal waste and noise, i.e. still sold with P4 and even P4 D processors and video cards with noisy fans.

There is no Vista MCE yet. Apple has nothing yet, and Linux is probably out of the question by DCMA rule.

With the current software HD players already compromised, perhaps the whole HTPC will be abandoned in favour of more tightly controlled hardware players by the content providers?

Who knows?

[Blue_MiSfit]

Well, component is not supposed to be allowed, but I don't know if that's the case with current HD releases. I'm pretty sure that most of the Vista editions come with a media center application (not that I'd use it)..

I've had great results with MediaPortal, which is a very nice freeware HTPC application that uses DirectShow to decode.

It's true that most commercially available HTPCs are stupidly assembled :) A good cool and quiet unit could be built with a low power Athlon64, a very quiet case with 1 or 2 120mm fans, and a very quiet CPU cooler. Throw in a hard drive or two (which would likely be the loudest components), a passively cooled video card, and a good sound card, and you should be able to keep total power consumption under 300W, and thermal issues well regulated.

~MiSfit

[jeffy]

I'm pretty sure that most of the Vista editions come with a media center application (not that I'd use it)..

~MiSfit
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/footnotes.mspx
see note M.
"Windows Media Center is available in Windows Vista Home Premium and Windows Vista Ultimate."

[writersblock29]

@OEG

I could easily be wrong (formats change all the time), but to my knowledge the only difference between DVI and HDMI is that HDMI allows for audio transmission as well as video, making only one cable necessary to carry the full monty to your target. Since video cards specialize in video, there's no point to using an HDMI because there's no audio channeling from the video card. DVI allows for uncompressed transfer of a digital video signal to a monitor/HDTV exactly the same as HDMI will, eleminating the digital-to-analog-then-back-to-digital-again conversion hassle. All you really need to attach a card with DVI ports to an HDMI on a television/monitor is a cable with DVI connections on one end, HDMI on the other. These are pretty widely availible at most computer stores (actually, even Walmart has them in the electronics department), and you'll get exactly the same input as you would with a dedicated HDMI. You'll still need to connect your audio seperately, however, since you'll have no audio signal in this type of connection. For a home theater pc, this pretty much only involves the DVI-HDMI connection from your video card to your television, while linking a digital coax or optical wire from your sound card to your reciever. Your video card can then be set to match your monitor's native resolution, making your video card an efficient video upscaler (provided the playback software you're using will allow for it--not all will; some only play a source back at its native resolution, descaling it on your monitor from whatever your video card's set to). Ensure that your soundcard software's not doing any pre-processing, since your audio reciever will do all of that itself (you'll also have to police your DVD playback software, since some don't understand that you're not using PC speakers if you don't specifically tell them), and you're pretty much connected. The rest of your headaches are limitted to setting up a remote control and/or wireless keyboard and mouse.

[KoD]

The audio channel in HDMI is also limited in bitrate, so it's not really good.

[lucassp]

The audio channel in HDMI is also limited in bitrate, so it's not really good.

HDMI also includes support for 8-channel uncompressed digital audio at 192kHz sample rate with 24 bits/sample as well as any compressed stream such as Dolby Digital, or DTS. HDMI supports up to 8 channels of one-bit audio, such as that used on Super Audio CDs at rates up to 4x that used by SuperAudio CD. With version 1.3, HDMI now also supports very high bitrate lossless compressed streams such as Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio.

I gues it's enough :D

[OEG]

Does any of the current HMDI cards feature this?

I believe it only comes in the latest nVidia 8800 cards, of which to my knowledge no HDMI edition yet exists.

Such a powerful chip is overkill for a HTPC and can hardly be kept cool by a passive cooling solution?

Another answer I have not yet found: does HDMI display the desktop and such in Windows mode or is HDMI reserved for media output only?

Some cards I found allow for an optical audio connection from the motherboard, so that way you have HD video and audio in the one HDMI cable, fully serving its purpose thereby.

The whole purpose of a HTPC stands or falls with your fair use rights being granted by the content provider or to be taken in your own hands by hacking the software player or some other component.
If I can only play HD content I'd better buy a stand alone player to go with the display. I just want one box capable of receiving HD off satellite, recording and playing back at will using a harddrive solution nd playing discs. Any writing to permanent storage media will most likely involve breaking the law.

All in all I think it is better to wait for a year or so to see how HD catches on in Europe.

[Inventive Software]

Why HDMI output specifically? Surely the thing you're needing is HDCP, in which case, check out this link (http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2874) of HDCP-capable cards. Some of them are HDMI, so pick one based on performance and budget, but remember that ATI has yet to release their next-gen cards. ;)

[lucassp]

What about the most important H264 hardware decoding?
Does any of the current HMDI cards feature this?

Current PureVideo and AVIVO supported cards have assisted hardware decoding but no 100% hardware decoding!