AVCHD compatibility testing

[kensystem]

I recently bought the new Sony HDR-SR1 and am very pleased with the video quality, though it's low-light noise level is disappointing.

I have chosen to always use the non-compromising 15Mb/s mode; this still gives an acceptable ~40 minutes of storage on a DVD-R.

I decided to try playing AVCHD formatted DVD/4.7GB discs (i.e built by the Sony software) on the Samsung Bluray player that's in stores: The player refused to recognize the disc, apparently becasue it was 4.7GB disc but with Bluray folder structure.

Has anyone had the chance to try playing AVCHD structured 4.7GB disc on the new Philps player.. even the not-yet released Sony or Pioneer or Panasonic?

My next test will be re-encoding (with ffmpeg) all my old LP mode (1.5 hour) DV tapes into AVC/AAC at native 720x480 and 6Mbps/256Kbps, then see if:

-the sony software will create AVCHD discs out of mp4 container files...
-see if the various BD players works as expected with 720x480 material -- mostly to compare/appreciate the quality gain by using AVC vs. my old Mpeg2 discs.

[easy2Bcheesy]

AVCHD discs work in the PlayStation3. The Samsung's latest firmware revision disabled the support, but apparently AVCHD disks work just fine in Panasonic BD players.

[kensystem]

The Samsung's latest firmware revision disabled the support

Wow, is there a thread or other information on why (technically or politically) they did this? Was it just an accident or do they plan on fixing it?

[easy2Bcheesy]

The BD spec allows for CE manufacturers to only *optionally* support disks that have no copy protection. Sony and Panasonic have taken the option to support it as they require it for AVCHD discs. Samsung have obviously decided not to support it :|

Check out this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=748875&highlight=firmware+update+samsung+camera) thread from someone else who is not happy about it.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I was just reading-up about the Samsung BD-P1000 player. It seems to be missing quite a few features compared to the Panasonic DMP-BD10 and Sony players.

For instance, it can't spin DVD+R or +RW disc's and it can't decode the proposed new higher-quality surround sound formats, ie: DTS-HD Master Audio, Dolby Digital Plus and Dolby Digital True HD....

[kensystem]

Samsung have obviously decided not to support it

Wow, that's a tragedy. Not only because people might want to playback their homemade AVCHD stuff, but also (like I) re-encode old SD material with a superior codec. I just compared some 6Mb AVC codec material (from my DV tapes) to the 6Mb MPEG2 disc Ive made.... very noticeable improvement esp. in dark areas and hi motion and over macroblock noise reduction.

I sure hope they save face and fix it to work again.

[kensystem]

So the sony software does not support AVCHD disc creation from mp4 material. For starters it seems that I would have to remux the mp4's I've created with ffmpeg, into an m2ts. Or if it is possible, encode directly into an m2ts.

Does anyone know if this is possible? I presume that I'd need to keep the VBR-TS characteristic since I'm doing a VBR encode (to avoid padding an oversize the disc). But I seem to recall that the various tools weren't reading/wring m2ts yet...

[easy2Bcheesy]

I can't help there but if you bought a PS3, it would play your MP4 AVC streams directly without any authoring or muxing. It would play them from an external USB device or straight from DVD-R.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Are you able to confirm what containers you've muxed MPEG-4 AVC video streams into and are supported by the PS3?

[easy2Bcheesy]

MP4 only so far with an unconfirmed, but probably true report that .m2ts AVHC format is also supported. Do you think there's any chance that MP4 menu systems could be supported? I think it's highly unlikely, but if you have a sample file to try I could get my contact to give it a go.

[Favorito]

Does PS3 support High Profile AVC playback? What about HE-AAC?

[CruNcher]

Favorito officialy it can't unofficialy dunno ;)

[kensystem]

BIG FAT WARNING:

With release of the Sony BDP-S1 and it's inability to play BD formatted DVD+-R and/or BD-R disc (as is the case with Samsung's), one will research and find out that there is a pending ("early 2007") firmware update to support this -- and that what it will change, is that will enable playback of consumer-authored content from the **BDAV** folder on the disc, NOT the BDMV folder.

What does this mean? If you own a Sony (and also maybe Panasonic?) AVCHD camcorder and are archiving to DVD-R hoping that they will play back when you buy a BD player, STOP.

The software Sony bundled with their AVCHD camcorders is writing into the HDMV folder, which may not be supported, ever. (why consumer vs. studio content should be bound to specific folders is way beyond my logical reasoning). It appears that we have to wait for a new version of the Sony software that will author into the DBAV folder, otherwise, it may be safer just to create a simple data disc backup of your m2ts files for now (unless you have ample hard disk space to store those files until BDAV authoring software is available). If you already archived to BDMV folders (like I did), it may be necessary later on to re-author the raw contents of the STREAM folder. PITA, seemingly.

[kensystem]

It appears that after sorting through limited authoritative online information, that the Sony and Samsung players *will* eventually be able to play consumer authored discs in the BDMV format/folder, and that the BDAV disc format will not be required to author home movies.

So, it... may be... safe to continue using the "Create AVCHD disc" option that Sony provides.....

[CruNcher]

Maybe they wanna fee for the customer playback support and took it out of the firmware before everyone noticed they left it in ;), wouldn't suprise me as they have all the power now and in the future todo everything they wan't, and let the user pay for any aditional support (even resolution).

[Bigmango]

How is 480p support on an AVCHD structured disk ?

All the authoring software I have looked at only author AVCHD with 720p and 1080p. Is there any way to author such disks (that will play in blu-ray players) with 480p video ?

And more importantly, can blu-ray players play such disks (480p AVCHD structured DVDs)?

The idea here is to backup 480p DVD (mpeg2) sources into h264 disks to preserve quality or putting several movie backups on 1 DVD-9.

Well, I guess 480p AVCHD should be called AVCSP ? :rolleyes:

[Bigmango]

So nobody knows ?

Can Blu-ray/HDDVD players play DVD disks with 480p AVC ? The AVCHD spec is 720p and 1080p, but can they play 480p avc ?

Thanks.

[SealTooGreat]

I'm interesting in that, too!

[Trahald]

Using scenarists spec sheet as a judge, yeah, 480p/576p is allowed. aspect_ratio_idc = (4PAL/5NTSC) for 16:9 and (2PAL/3NTSC) for 4:3

is that a gaurantee... no.. but being a pro app its not likely wrong.

[Bigmango]

Using scenarists spec sheet as a judge, yeah, 480p/576p is allowed. aspect_ratio_idc = (4PAL/5NTSC) for 16:9 and (2PAL/3NTSC) for 4:3

is that a gaurantee... no.. but being a pro app its not likely wrong.

Awesome, thanks a lot.