MeGUI Custom x264/AVC video profiles.

[berrinam]

Ah ... thanks! Works great now.
I've added some handlers which should avoid this crash in version 0.2.3.2020. I've not actually been able to reproduce the crash when Decomb.dll was missing, so when a release comes out, could you see whether this still causes a crash?

Thanks

[The Link]

I've added some handlers which should avoid this crash in version 0.2.3.2020. I've not actually been able to reproduce the crash when Decomb.dll was missing, so when a release comes out, could you see whether this still causes a crash?

Thanks
It doesn't crash now but it would be nice if the decomb.dll warning would pop up before the analyzing process starts imho.

[berrinam]

It doesn't crash now but it would be nice if the decomb.dll warning would pop up before the analyzing process starts imho.
It's AviSynth's fault, though, for not giving any error messages when the dll is missing. As a result, the only indication that anything went wrong is the fact that the output log file has the words "I don't know what "a" means" in it. That's all that AviSynth says.

Anyway, I can see that it's a waste of time, but I would hope that each user would only do this once, so overall it isn't too bad.

[Manao]

It's AviSynth's fault, though, for not giving any error messages when the dll is missingOpen your script with virtualdub, you'll see a nice error message printed on the frame :). It's a wanted feature of frameevaluate, because it can't know, when instanciating the filters graph, what filters will be needed by frameevaluate. So it can only say that something's missing when displaying the first frame.

If you want to check whether IsDecomb exists or not, just add a line "global unused_ = IsCombed(clip, 32)" somewhere in your script.

[berrinam]

If you want to check whether IsDecomb exists or not, just add a line "global unused_ = IsCombed(clip, 32)" somewhere in your script.
Thanks Manao. I presume that also has very little effect on speed, being an unused clip?

[JarrettH]

Well the movie Broken Flowers @104min took approximately:

HQ-SLOW 950kbps 6hrs
HQ-SLOWEST 950kbps 15hrs

Using a P4 2.8GHz w/HT and OCZ 512MBx2 2-2-2
Actually I didn't finish slowest but it was at 57% so I added the remaining time to the elapsed time. I used 950kbps so that I still had room to mux the aac audio after on 1CD. I don't think I'll be using Slowest mode again:sly:
I'll try HQ-SLOWER with 1000kbps and see if I can still fit the aac on with 1CD if it compresses more as you say.:)

[Manao]

Thanks Manao. I presume that also has very little effect on speed, being an unused clip?Indeed, it shouldn't. But as I didn't try, I can't be totally positive :)

[lexor]

hey guys, does any of the profiles (qt compatibility one for example) qualify for streaming video over internet? granted I'll still need to figure out how to use the whole hint track and all that jazz for streaming, but that doesn't belong here.

I want it to be streamable, not necessarily QT compliant (since coreAVC cameout with their browser plugin), but using HQ and such for streaming bitrates isn't exaclty a good idea. So any of the profiles qualify as optimal for this use or do we need to research one more?

[smok3]

lexor, iam just remuxing with hint track using mp4box and seems to work fine for qt (streaming? well i call that progressive download.)

cmd could be simply:

mp4box film.mp4 -hint

[JarrettH]

Update:

Well the movie Broken Flowers @104min took approximately:

HQ-SLOW 950kbps 6hrs
HQ-SLOWER 1000kbps 15hrs
HQ-SLOWEST 950kbps 18hrs

I should have put 18hrs for SLOWEST because I forgot about the first pass!

@Sharktooth...Is there anything I can do using the Slow profile to increase the quality but not drastically increase the encode time? Something like under 10hrs is good.

[JarrettH]

I chose to bump:D

I began customizing the Slow profile after EXHAUSTIVELY reading about the settings. I stuck with Broken Flowers (106min)...

1000kbps
No Fast P-Skip: Checked
Reference Frames: 8 + mixed
ALL B-Frame options: Checked

Ran the above with Multi-Hex on a P4 3.0GHz (Prescott) 2x256MB and Hexagon on a P4 2.8GHz (Northwood) 2x512MB 2-2-2.
In summary, both would have taken too long! 13hrs for Multi-Hex and 13hrs for Hex. Both computers were getting too oversized files anyway for the audio I needed to mux.

Tonight I'll run...

1000kbps
No Fast P-Skip: Checked
Reference Frames: 5 Both Computers
ALL B-Frame options: Checked
Multi-Hex: Both Computers
Soulhunter V2 matrix <3 (on Northwood), None (on Prescott)

I suspect mixed was slowing them down. A few more (10-20) kbps in the video isn't worth an hour of encoding time to me :) So I'll find out tonight how large a time difference there is between 5 and 8 ref frames, and if 5 frames ends up being <10hrs I think it's a keeper!
950kbps is the highest I got to encoding the movie with space for the audio. I'm trying 1000kbps again to see if any of the settings + matrix help with compression.

Edit* Got some ridiculous oversize (47mb file) at 5% into the 2nd pass using 8 ref frames. Now both comps have the same settings different matrix in use. I don't know what made the original HQ-Slow profile great for file sizes, the settings will be identical soon enough. LOL
Is there something in x264 between 950kbps and 1000kbps that would cause this?

Help me!

[quake74]

Hi Sharktooth, the profiles in your latest standard x264 package and the v20 on the first page of this thread are different (I looked at the psp one). Which are the newest?

[bob0r]

About xbox profile (i tried to post this like 4x, but 4x something messed up and it never came here)
So here it is:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=784123#post784123

[Sharktooth]

Profiles are a bit outdated. I'll update them as soon as i get back from the hostpital.

[aichan]

i would to encode CG dvd movies like ice age, finding nemo....

which profile should i take, HQ slow or AE-goodquality? is it CG movies an anime/toon source??

thx :)

[Sharktooth]

cg is something in "between"... you can effectively use both profiles (until i update them).

[Sharktooth]

v21: big update. updated many profiles with speed ups expecially for CQ-Lossless.

[jackiehcs]

cg is something in "between"... you can effectively use both profiles (until i update them).
In fact, there is always "CG" in anime.
Should I use 0,0 for deblocking in order to get better picture quality?

[Sharktooth]

well, it depends on the sharpness/smoothness you want to obtain.
try different settings on small clips and choose the values you prefer.
keep in mind anime profiles have deblocking set to 1,1 while movie profiles have deblocking set to -2,-1.

[quake74]

Hi Shark, about the psp profile, did you see this message http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=755401#post755401 ? I myself canot confirm it because I have a 2.0, but maybe we could revert back to 2 ref and nobframes. Moreover the psp has very little storage, so it's more likely that people go down into the very low bitrates (200kbps and lower) and in those cases bframes could actually decrease the quality of the movie...

[max-holz]

Ciao Sharktooth
I noticed that in the Rev. 21 you have changed the B-frame mode of the HQ profiles from temporal to spatial, why that?

[Sharktooth]

IMHO spatial give better quality and helps a bit with blocking in dark areas.

[Sharktooth]

Hi Shark, about the psp profile, did you see this message http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=755401#post755401 ? I myself canot confirm it because I have a 2.0, but maybe we could revert back to 2 ref and nobframes. Moreover the psp has very little storage, so it's more likely that people go down into the very low bitrates (200kbps and lower) and in those cases bframes could actually decrease the quality of the movie...
b-frames do not decrease quality at lower bitrates... theoretically it should be exactly the other way.
however i'll see what i can do.

[fight2win]

[QUOTE=Sharktooth]
Download link: MeGUI-x264 Custom Video Profiles V21. (http://www.webalice.it/f.corriga/megui/MeGUI-x264_generic_profiles_v21.7z)

Dude, are these profiles supported by chronocross x264 rev 445 builds?

[Sharktooth]

445 is buggy

[quake74]

b-frames do not decrease quality at lower bitrates... theoretically it should be exactly the other way.

Not to get started again on "The Coolness of B-Frames" but yesterday I encoded video at 128kbps and the one with 3bframes was worse than the one without (both by SSIM, and just by looking at the frames). (Out of curiosity, at 192kbps they were essentially the same, and at 256kbps the bframes win.)

[fight2win]

445 is buggy
ok, can it be used with bobor's rev 449?

[Sharktooth]

yes, but it does not support subme 7 (it will automatically use 6 when needed)

[Chainmax]

But it does work with ChronoCross's v438 (which is supposed to include all your patches), right?

By the way, does the XBOX lowres profile allow for custom matrices? I'd like to try mp4_guy's_AVC_Low_Bitrate_matrix_V2.cfg on an encode.

[Sharktooth]

yes and no

[Chainmax]

I see, time to make a suggestion to the XBMC devs then :).

[Sharktooth]

I see, time to make a suggestion to the XBMC devs then :).
xbox has it's own CPU limits... stick with default quantization.

[Chainmax]

I didn't think a custom quant matrix would put much extra decoding strain.

[Sharktooth]

custom quant matrix require High-Profile...

[foxyshadis]

You can actually decode flat-16 matrix much faster than any cq, because it's just a shift-by-4 for each coefficient, plus you have to guard against low coefficients overflowing in uber-high matrices. That's why it's part of High Profile. With an optimized decoder it probably wouldn't make a big difference overall though.

[Chainmax]

custom quant matrix require High-Profile...
But profiles are just a tag, what matters are the actual features used. foxyshadis's argument seems logical though (not that I know anything about the subject), do you agree with it?

[Zep]

yes, it "should"... but some features are broken. baseline will work with no doubts :P

Quicktime's latest h.264 encoder and h.264 decoder handle different levels. The decoder handles everything in main profile except B-Pyramid which will cause stuttering and then a buffer overflow.

Qt 7.0.5 should fix that with the new version of the decoder. (well that is what was said on the QT dev list anyway)

I use your main profile with B-Pyramid off and have never had a problem. In fact the QT decoder plays smoother and with less CPU demand than ffdshow for me.

[bond]

Quicktime's latest h.264 encoder and h.264 decoder handle different levels. The decoder handles everything in main profile except B-Pyramid which will cause stuttering and then a buffer overflow.the decoder doesnt handle (correctly)
- mixed references (baseline profile)
- more than 1 b-frames (main profile)
- b-references/pyramid (main profile)
- interlacing (main profile)
- 8x8dct (high profile)
- i8x8 (high profile)
- cqm (high profile)
- lossless (high profile)

and surely much more i now forgot :D

I use your main profile with B-Pyramid off and have never had a problem. In fact the QT decoder plays smoother and with less CPU demand than ffdshow for me. troll?

[Zep]

the decoder doesnt handle (correctly)
- mixed references (baseline profile)
- more than 1 b-frames (main profile)
- b-references/pyramid (main profile)
- interlacing (main profile)
- 8x8dct (high profile)
- i8x8 (high profile)
- cqm (high profile)
- lossless (high profile)

and surely much more i now forgot :D

troll?

You better read my post again because i said QT handles the options. I never said how or to what you consider
"(correctly)". In fact 7.0.4 on mixed references just hands off to an empty stub and play back works fine and that is
the point i was making in my post about the options. That the decoder will play back fine so to expand on that
you do not need to make 2 target encodes or 1 encode that has options turned off since only 1 main profile option
messes up play back with the current release decoder.

next you listed high profile stuff. we are talking about main profile. Are YOU trolling? You appear to be by
making your list bigger than it should be lol

As for b-frames are you kidding me? i use more than 1 b-frame ALL the time and the 7.0.4+ decoders play my encodes
back PERFECTLY and ALL b-frames are shown perfectly. This makes me think you have never even tried 2+ b-frames
in QT play back. Are using the old specs on apples site?

Anyway, If Apple sticks to the plan 7.1 will address ALL the remaining issues AND now that OSX and QT are x86 native
the performance of QT on the windows side is MUCH better and going to improve even more since the QT dev team coders
have gotten better at x86 coding and it shows already in 7.0.4+ and the current beta is very nice. PPC is history and
all efforts are going into mactel now.

Me a troll? nope. I simply stated what happens on my dev box. I'm sorry it is not what you like to hear but get used
to it since Apple is mactel now and intel has made one sweet compiler tool set for apple :)

[Sharktooth]

Dude, are you kidding?
QT = CRAP and is severely limited in playback capabilities.
Bond is perfectly right on the unsupported features, i personally tested (and bond too) EVERY single option and came to his same conclusions. And dude... i dont know how the hell you MISCONFIGURED ffdshow but there's no way it's slower than QT.
Next time :serch: before posting.

[foxyshadis]

Look, have you guys even installed 7.0.4 to find out?


11 January, 2006
QuickTime 7.0.4 is an important release that delivers numerous bug fixes, support for iLife '06, and H.264 performance improvements. This update is highly recommended for all QuickTime 7 users.


Whether it's all that and a bag of chips or not (ffdshow and any DS player is probably still better), it still sounds like a definite improvement over QT 7.0. There's also been a definite drop-off in "OMG QUICKTIME CAN'T PLAY MY MOVIES" threads since January.

[Sharktooth]

i tried 7.05.

[Zep]

Dude, are you kidding?
QT = CRAP and is severely limited in playback capabilities.
Bond is perfectly right on the unsupported features, i personally tested (and bond too) EVERY single option and came to his same conclusions. And dude... i dont know how the hell you MISCONFIGURED ffdshow but there's no way it's slower than QT.
Next time :serch: before posting.

"Dude" i just played an encode i did last night and it played great with 3 b-frame runs and b-pyramid off. That right there proves you wrong on the current release if you also claim 1 b-frame only. Sure you were correct back when you tested old versions but i never claimed otherswise.

"Dude" i do not know how the hell you MISCONFIGURED QT.
(see i can play that game also)

To make you happy today i did a clean install of milan's current version of ffdshow and then i went and made sure the only thing on was the H.264 option in the video decoder and i turned only the acc option on in the audio decoder JUST to make sure nothing else was conflicting from the defaults after you first install which played the same as i claimed for me in my first post. Still plays worse and still stutters now and then unlike QT or Elecard decoders. This may point to the encode having a combo of settings that ffdshow does not like that i use to make QT on Macs and PCs play fine and one variation(s) you never tried on many. I tested many many variations.

And speaking of testing you never said what version of QT you tested. At least in my posts i told you what version of QT. Also this is a QT thing. Not JUST a Windows QT thing. I test on both my G5 and my AMD dev boxes. You just saying you tested then making this global claim that "QT = CRAP" is in itself crap when you don't even bother to post the basics like what version of QT you tested. Anyway, you can't just turn one option on then another and another without turning others OFF else you never see how they all interact with each other. Furthermore, based on your post you give the impression you threw bond's name around without having any idea HOW he tested and what version of QT and if he even tested on both platforms etc...

NOTE: i have always claimed FOR ME. (read my first post again because YOU missed that) I never said it ran better as some global fact for everyone. Did you take note of that? NO you did NOT all you did was shoot from the hip with an attack and you did make global claim that "QT = CRAP" ( windows version is not as good as mac version but duh... ever use WMP on OSX? it works both ways if you know what i mean lol)

ffdshow and QT currently are moot to me anyway since I went back to using elecard decoder since it plays better than both by wide margin. On my Mac i use QT (though mplayer and VLC work fine too for most h.264 encodes)

[Zep]

Look, have you guys even installed 7.0.4 to find out?



Whether it's all that and a bag of chips or not (ffdshow and any DS player is probably still better), it still sounds like a definite improvement over QT 7.0. There's also been a definite drop-off in "OMG QUICKTIME CAN'T PLAY MY MOVIES" threads since January.

foxyshadis i admit 7.0 IMHO sucked arse LOL in fact IMHO 7.01 and 7.0.2 suck also. QT fans boys disagree with me but that is fine cause everyone has different needs and set ups. it wasn't until 7.0.3 that i think Apple should have released it as 7.0 but as always that is just my opinion.

yes i noticed the drop off in the "OMG QUICKTIME CAN'T PLAY MY MOVIES" threads also and not just on doom9. My guess is that 7.0.4.11 finally got most of h.264 major playback issues fixed (well not all since b-pyramid on is brutal and crashes both mac QT and Windows QT most of the time but that is what 7.0.5 is for haha)

[Sharktooth]

hey... read all the posts and you'll see i wrote "i tried QT 7.05" (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=798210#post798210).
Also if you bother searching the forums you can find all the tests we did (yes, me and bond and maybe others)...
also milan's latest (compiled) version of FFDSHOW is OUTDATED. Install celtic druid's or bobors's latest builds...
also, it has been proven in multiple tests that the QT AVC decoder is seriously crippled...
also if you used x264 for encoding ensure you unchecked "adaptive b-frames" before yelling QT can decode more than 1 b-frame correctly...
also, i re-tested QT 7.05 on 3 different PCs and it still owns the crown of the slowest and most crippled pseudo-AVC decoder.

EDIT: also read the AVC decoders comparison: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=99402 coz your beloved elecard decoder is one of the slowest and ffdshow outperforms it by far... but if you want the fastest avc decoder for win just look for CoreAVC...

[Sharktooth]

v22:
- removed subme 7 so profiles can be used with MeGUI-svn.
- updated b.frames mode to spatial for single pass profiles and auto to 2 passes profiles.
- some adjustments here and there :)

[poiuy]

v22:
- removed subme 7 so profiles can be used with MeGUI-svn.

Thanks.

[smok3]

anything new in CE quicktime ? (no, iam not trolling :D)

[Sharktooth]

uhm... --direct auto ?

[jackiehcs]

I find that encoding with "CQ-ASP_Q2_eq(crf)" shows better result than encoding with "AE-Maxquality" even with a bitrate 100kbps higher...

[Sharktooth]

we all know CRF is good... but i doubt it can be better than a higher bitrate encode...
can you post some screenshots or small clips?
however AE-Maxquality is tuned for Anime...

[BoostAddict]

uhm... --direct auto ?

yessir some of the profiles give me this error

bad argument: --direct auto

[berrinam]

Update to a newer build of x264

[Sharktooth]

:stupid:

[jackiehcs]

That's fine. The source is anime.
I just misunderstood that 3pass was always the best even comparing with CRF.

[JarrettH]

Hey

Insane idea...

I want to record the semi-final and final of the brier on the weekend...would it be crazy to try to record TV with x264?

[berrinam]

Capturing straight to x264? Yes, that is a bad idea. Probably, x264 won't keep up, and you don't have any opportunity to resize/crop unless you know what the cropping is going to be in advance. Better is to capture to something lossless like HuffYUV, then encode to x264 after filtering. There's nothing wrong with that.

[Chainmax]

v22:
- removed subme 7 so profiles can be used with MeGUI-svn.
- updated b.frames mode to spatial for single pass profiles and auto to 2 passes profiles.
- some adjustments here and there :)

Does that means that no profile has subme7 now? Speaking of which, can subme7 be enabled without a playback speed hit on a 512x384 encode for the XBOX?

[Sharktooth]

Yes, it means no profile has subme 7 coz there are no actual builds that support it (also the p8rd patch is not applicable to the actual revisions).
subme option doesnt affect playback speed.

[Chainmax]

Yes, it means no profile has subme 7 coz there are no actual builds that support it

Not even your last compile and Chronocross's rev438 compile? And what is the p8rd patch?

[JarrettH]

I don't have the disk space for 3hrs of huffyuv :/
Actually x264 wasn't too bad with the right options, still won't be using it, however.
You should try making a live TV profile sharktooth! :)

[Sharktooth]

Not even your last compile and Chronocross's rev438 compile? And what is the p8rd patch?
Those are pretty old. Use the new revisions instead.
the p8rd patch is the one that adds subme 7.
I don't have the disk space for 3hrs of huffyuv :/
Actually x264 wasn't too bad with the right options, still won't be using it, however.
You should try making a live TV profile sharktooth! :)
ok. in the next version there will be a new set of profiles for live encoding (you'll need a really fast CPU though).

[Chainmax]

Those are pretty old. Use the new revisions instead.
the p8rd patch is the one that adds subme 7.

I'd rather have a build with all your patches, p8rd included.

[Sharktooth]

newer builds are faster and better qualitywise...

[foxyshadis]

Well, Chainmax, now that subme 7 is in svn you won't have to wait long for a CC build with it. :p

[Sharktooth]

Updated profiles are coming...

[JarrettH]

:cool: :devil:

[DarkFoon]

I'm a little confused. are you not making builds anymore?
If not, how shall we get your profiles? (three downloads: 1. x264, 2. meGUI x264, 3. your profiles?)
gone are the days of simplicity

[foxyshadis]

The first post of this thread, maybe? :p Maybe if you ask CC nicely he'd be willing to bundle them.

[Sharktooth]

V23 (major update):
- Faster HQ profiles (all).
- Better quality for QuickTime and PSP profile.
- 3passes profiles now use 2passes (3 passes are a waste of encoding time)
- RDO lvl 2 (subme 7) is back on the slowest profiles
- Enabled 8x8dct and i8x8 in both Xbox profiles (if you have playback problems update to the latest XBMC)
- Other small changes

[Sharktooth]

@JarrettH: Use 1p-Maxspeed for live encoding. There is no way to create "useable" profiles for live encoding unless they're used on stellar computers...

[Chainmax]

Now I just have to wait until CC releases a new compile and download an all new package :). I have a few questions though:

1) Will the upcoming CC compiles have all of Sharktooth's patches?
2) How come 3-pass is now considered a waste of encoding time?
3) Will the XBOX profiles be updated to include no fast pskip and subme7?

[Sharktooth]

CC has already released an updated x264 build...
http://chronocrossdev.com/apps/x264/ <- updated x264
http://chronocrossdev.com/apps/megui/ <- updated MeGUI

1 - Yes
2 - Coz 3 passes are needed only when the 2nd pass misses the filesize.
3 - Only if ppl doesnt mind loosing encoding speed...

[Sharktooth]

I'm a little confused. are you not making builds anymore?
If not, how shall we get your profiles? (three downloads: 1. x264, 2. meGUI x264, 3. your profiles?)
gone are the days of simplicity
sorry for the delay... i missed your post...
Well, my x264 builds will be back. Don't know when but they will...
My profiles are also compatible with all x264 builds floating around, so you need only to get the latest MeGUI (if it's not already bundled with the build) and unzip the profiles in the MeGUI directory.

[DarkFoon]

I can't seem to find MeGUI-x263 bundled with any x264 builds. Was x264-meGUI dropped and everybody foreced to use MeGUI?
thank you for getting back to me, though.

[berrinam]

Yes, it was. It's not like full MeGUI is any worse...

Anyway, if you object to being forced, you can always try some other program, but the way it is now is much easier for us developers.

[DarkFoon]

I am a fool.
I found MeGUI bundled with an x264 build (sorry for the noise)
but I seem to be having some problem with MeGUI on my encoding computer. I'll file a bug report(?) in the proper forum.
again, sorry for the noise.

[Cyberace]

Will the XBOX profiles be updated to include no fast pskip and subme7?Only if ppl doesnt mind loosing encoding speed...I for one don't mind as long as it does not affect decoding speed/smoothness on the Xbox, sacrificing encoding time for quality is (almost) always worth it

[Sharktooth]

Decoding is not affected by both options but encoding speed will drop seriously. You can try it by yourself modifying the profile.
However if the majoriry of xbox users wants more quality at expense of encoding speed i'll add those options in the next version.

[Sharktooth]

V24:
Enabled RDO Lvl.2 and No Fast PSkip options in Xbox profiles (more quality, lower encoding speed).

[thuongshoo]

Hi ! I have just read a guide for x264 VFW . Thank Deadsheep !
I want to read a same doc for x264 in MEGUI . Can anyone help me ?
Thanks !

[soresu]

There should be a guide to MeGUI at the top of this sub-forum

[thuongshoo]

I don't want to use profiles . I want to adjust all .
x264 VFW guide help me all

[berrinam]

I don't want to use profiles . I want to adjust all .The options are mostly the same in MeGUI, but there are some renamed ones and some extra ones. However, MeGUI has a tooltip which displays for basically every option in x264. Try reading them if you want. However, you will probably find that there is already a Sharktooth profile which does what you want in the end.

[Sharktooth]

I don't want to use profiles . I want to adjust all .
x264 VFW guide help me all
so you're off topic...
However, you will probably find that there is already a Sharktooth profile which does what you want in the end.
exactly :)

[thuongshoo]

but there are some renamed ones and some extra ones. .
yes ! This make me misunderstand . I must look up dictionary again :D
so you're off topic
I really don't understand this sentence . I'm sorry ! I shouldn't post my request at this thread .
I will do "some searching " :D

[DarkFoon]

I really don't understand this sentence . I'm sorry ! I shouldn't post my request at this thread .
I will do "some searching " :D

what sharktooth means is that there are no profiles for VFW version (he hates VFW) and this topic thread is for the profiles used in MeGUI.

[foxyshadis]

Best way to do profiles for vfw is to set up your favorite config, export the registry file, and repeat. Import whatever you want for the session before you start. I've been doing that for ages with xvid, much faster than manually resetting them. (Maybe deaththesheep will upload a few, I don't have it installed.)

[Sharktooth]

what sharktooth means is that there are no profiles for VFW version (he hates VFW) and this topic thread is for the profiles used in MeGUI.
well, not properly. he said he wants to "adjust all" so he's off topic coz here we're discussing of profiles/presets that's exactly what he doesnt want.

[tehpwner2]

Is there are way to load your profiles using virtual dub?? Can you set one of your profiles as default?

[Sharktooth]

no. profiles are for MeGUI (but some other softwares added compatibility with them) and even include options that are not present in x264 VFW.
I suggest dropping virtualdub and use one of the GUI (like staxrip, megui, realanime...) for x264 encoding.
x264 VFW has several drawbacks and does not actually include all the x264 CLI options.

[DarkFoon]

@tehpwner2
Switching to a GUI application like sharktooth reccomends really is easier. And if you want to edit your movie with virtualdub(mod) you can use the frame serving capabilites of Vdub to serve up your edited clip or you can edit your clip in an avisynth script and serve it to the x264 GUI (whichever you choose) like that.

[tehpwner2]

Thanks friends! I am finding staxrip fairly easy to use.

[Bathrone]

Respect++ to Sharktooth for these profiles. Made it so easy, thanks mate.

[Bathrone]

Ok Sharktooth I have some more to advise on the outcomes for my XBMC testing of your PD_XBOX-HiRes profiles version 24.

During the encode, the only changes I make to your default profile is to set the number of threads to 2 for my machine and the bitrate, which I usually set around 1056kbps. I am currently using an XBMC build for 08/04/06.

640x256x25fps - plays well in all modes

704x400x25fps - drops frames with the high quality pixel shader render method. If the user changes the render method to hardware overlays, no frames are lost.

Keeping the original PAL 720x576x25fps and using MeGUI to set the SAR for anomorphic - drops frames in all modes.

Were not talking about a huge amount of dropped frames, but its enough to momentarily cause a stutter in playback.

[berrinam]

@Sharktooth: I'm sure you've seen my changes on the MeGUI dev thread, but it is now possible to use MeGUI to export and import profiles. It uses exactly the same directory structure (inside the archive) as yours, but with zip files as opposed to 7z. I don't know if you're interested in going back to zip format, but it would mean that they can be installed via MeGUI, and your can distribute them with CQMs.

Just letting you know.

[Sharktooth]

@Bathrone: full D1 anamorphic resolution encodings are pretty hard to play back on the xbox. i think keeping the current settings is better than cripple the codec to make the playback of 720x576 possible on the xbox.
it's possible future versions of XBMC will have less problems though.

@Berrinam: yeah, i saw the changes and im sorry i still havent the possibility to spend some time on coding MeGUI (or even update the profiles...). Health care is my first priority for now.

[Backflip]

640x256x25fps - plays well in all modes

704x400x25fps - drops frames with the high quality pixel shader render method. If the user changes the render method to hardware overlays, no frames are lost.

What sort pace is the footage at? Slow, Medium, Fast? Also, what cache settings etc do you use?

I shall try the latest Xbox profile, and see how it goes in the fast clip I have.

[Chainmax]

V24:
Enabled RDO Lvl.2 and No Fast PSkip options in Xbox profiles (more quality, lower encoding speed).

Cool, thanks :).

[Bathrone]

What sort pace is the footage at? Slow, Medium, Fast? Also, what cache settings etc do you use?

I shall try the latest Xbox profile, and see how it goes in the fast clip I have.

I have XBMC configured to reduce unnecessary loads. E.g. No post processing, no flicker filter, no smoothing. I have tested and confirmed the dropped frames over SMB as well as local HDD and DVDROM style playback. I have fiddled around with cache settings and ran debugmode for freememory display but the recent builds dont require caching changes from defaults to work with AVC playback. My setup requires a reduction in the local network cache size for 1080i playback. I have XBMX autodiscovery turned off, web server off and the ftp server off to free up enough ram - although it will run with the ftp server on following a reduction in the local network cache size.

I was advised by the XBMC Team that the upscaling is done in hardware and doesnt add to the cpu overhead for playback. I run a 720p GUI with video playback at 1080i.

Ive done lots of tests with different scenes on Sharktooth's v24 profiles and what Ive said above is the summary of the test outcomes. Were not talking about alot of dropped frames, but enough to stutter playback. The XBMC.log indicates dropped frames from mplayer.

Ive found good samples to use for testing are around 5 minutes long with a mix of high motion and low motion scenes.

@Sharktooth I hope new performance is in the works but I fear that mplayer is pretty optimised and I understand that coreavc wont be ported/stubbed. So in your judgement if you brough the PD-XBOX_HiRes profile down any further to allow full 720x576x25fps playback, there would be an unacceptable loss in compression?

[Backflip]

I use settings:
Video/Audio/DVD Cache - harddisk 4096 KB
Video Cache - DVDRom 8192 KB
Audio Cache - DVDRom 256 KB
DVD Cache - DVDRom 4096 KB

All others 0.

I've encoded a small music video clip, but it's x264 + 6CH AC3 *MKV* @ 704 x 384, with Xbox profile, 35MB. I like to keep the orgiinal audio. Plays fine. Yet to try x264 + LC-AAC for this particular clip though.

[Bathrone]

As I said, 704x400x25fps (5 minute clip mix of scenes) requires the hardware overlays not to drop frames. Your resolution is lower than this threshold.

It is not necessary to change the default cache size for AVC playback in the newest XBMC builds. Setting other aspects to zero will cause issues with video playback over SMB and so on. Some users with 1080i playback will require a reduction from the default local network video cache size to have enough free ram.

I have done tests with no audio stream to rule out that as a factor, which it isnt.

No amount of changes within the XBMC setup will enabled full PAL resolution playback using the hires profile for 720*576*25fps.

[Bathrone]

Here's a 21MB sample of PAL 720x576x25fps progressive footage transcoded into AVC with PD-XBOX_HiRes. Lost 21 frames with high quality pixel shader render method, on hardware overlays it still lost frames. Build is 12.04.06 CVS XBMC compile:

http://www.mytempdir.com/594462

My avi synth script:

# Set DAR in encoder to 16 : 9. The following line is for automatic signalling
global MeGUI_darx = 16
global MeGUI_dary = 9
DGDecode_mpeg2source("D:\Encoding\movies.d2v")
#Not doing anything because the source is progressive
#crop
#resize
#denoise

Command line for x264 (R498) PD-XBOX_HiRes profile (V24) with # of threads set to 2 and bitrate at 1200kbps:

C:\Program Files\x264\x264.exe --pass 2 --bitrate 1200 --stats ".stats" --no-fast-pskip --bframes 2 --b-rdo --bime --nf --no-cabac --subme 7 --analyse all --8x8dct --qpmin 18 --qcomp 0.3 --direct auto --me umh --threads 2 --thread-input --sar 16:9 --progress --no-psnr --output "D:\Encoding\movies.mp4" "D:\Encoding\movies.avs"

[Sharktooth]

720x576 is too much for the xbox.
use non anamorphic resolutions.
4:3 sources needs to be resized to 640*xxx.

[Limobar]

[...]No amount of changes within the XBMC setup will enabled full PAL resolution playback using the hires profile for 720*576*25fps.

I think it is not important to play full-dvd resolutions on the XBox for a couple of reasons:

1. The quality difference between square pixel- and anamorphic encodes is marginal. The general opinion is that, at this moment, 720x400 is the maximum the xbox can handle, using AVC/h.264. I share that opinion and think that is very good, knowing the hardware specs of the Xbox.

2. Anamorphic encoding takes 44% more pixels (720x400 versus 720x576), a lot more time to encode and a lot more MegaBytes to store (to use the same average kbits per pixel as square pixel).

3. The Xbox will put out the same resolution, whether the encode is anamorphic (720x576) or square pixel (720x400) is of non importance. Approximately 640x480 on Widescreen-tv's and 640x360 on Bigscreen-tv's.

[Bathrone]

Thanks Sharktooth and Limobar. You make some good points.

Just quickly, do you disagree that resizing can be bad for quality? For example this URL: http://www.100fps.com/how_resizing_affects_quality.htm

[Limobar]

Thanks Sharktooth and Limobar. You make some good points.

Just quickly, do you disagree that resizing can be bad for quality? For example this URL: http://www.100fps.com/how_resizing_affects_quality.htm

No, I don't disagree, resizing affects the original quality, but the examples you refer to, are not comparable to the resizing we are doing with our encodes.

That site is, for the most part, showing examples of extreme bicubic upscaling. With our encodes we are mainly talking about limited lanczos downscaling. There is a difference between bicubic resizing (neutral and soft) and lanczos (sharp) resizing and there is a difference between upscaling and downscaling. Upscaling has a much bigger impact on the quality than downscaling.

I can show you, in some degree, the quality difference between 640x352 (Bigscreen resolution) with a 720x576 anamorphic source, and 640x352 with a 720x400 square pixel source.

720x400 to 640x352:
http://i2.tinypic.com/vgsl5e.jpg

720x576 to 640x352:
http://i2.tinypic.com/vgsn6g.jpg

I think the '720x576 to 640x352' has slightly more detail, but the difference is too small to worry about.

The 720x400 encode has a 1500kbit/sec avg bitrate.
The 720x576 encode has a 2160kbit/sec avg bitrate.
The difference in bitrate makes the bitrate per pixel the same.


P.S. If you're encoding for Standard Resolution tv's exclusively, it might be a wise choice to use a 640 width and do the final downscaling during the encode to achieve the best quality.

[Sharktooth]

I've changed the profiles archive to zip so MeGUI can directly import the profiles (File/Import Profiles) into the MeGUI installation directory.

[Chainmax]

...
The general opinion is that, at this moment, 720x400 is the maximum the xbox can handle, using AVC/h.264
...

But with what features enabled? I'd rather have a 512x384 encode with deblocking, a good number of reference frames and mixed references than a 720x400 encode without those.

[Limobar]

But with what features enabled? I'd rather have a 512x384 encode with deblocking, a good number of reference frames and mixed references than a 720x400 encode without those.

No deblocking, no CABAC and no HE-AAC. That are the Xbox-restrictions, to be able to use 720x400. This might sound ugly, but to be honest, it's not as bad as it sounds.

Deblocking is a matter of taste and only useful using low bitrates. I use average bitrates between 1 and 1,5 Mbit and prefer not to use deblocking, even if I could.

Having to use CAVLC instead of CABAC is not a choice between qualities, but a choice between efficiencies. That's the reason why I use rather high bitrates, to compensate not using CABAC.

LC-NAAC (VBR, internet, High Quality) sounds great. HE-AAC might be a little bit more efficient, but its efficiency gain is marginal.

There's no doubt in my mind. I will always pick a higher resolution/higher bitrate over a lower resolution/lower bitrate. The quality difference justifies the 10-15% larger file size. Not using deblocking, CABAC and HE-AAC does not mean the quality has to suffer. Decreasing the video resolution certainly will.

[dexx]

Ive just downloaded and installed MeGui on my winxp system. When i try and run MeGui is crashes out straight away saying "application failed to initialize properly". Have i missed a step?

[buzzqw]

.Net framework already installed ???

BHH

[Sharktooth]

MeGUI needs .NET framework 2.0...

[check]

Sorry if this was suggested before, but have you considered adding a prefix to all the profiles, like "ST-" or something? I ask because I have a number of profiles myself and your collection gets placed all over (I can never remember the two letter prefixes :P), making the list harder to read.

[Sharktooth]

if you dont like their names you can rename them...

[Adub]

Good point sharktooth. :)

[foxyshadis]

Only problem there is everytime you update sharktooth's build, it recopies the presets with the original names in, making the problem worse... (same for deleting unwanted presets.)

I just prefix all mine with FX- and live with it. :D

[Sharktooth]

uhm, got it...
i'll see what i can do then...

[Adub]

Righteous!

[NeD tHe OnE]

Hey SharkTooth!

Can u plz help me with X.264?

I am totally new in this. Which Encoder should I use ? and where wil i get custom video profiles with settings guide !

Help!

[Sharktooth]

You can start with x264 CLI with an appropriate GUI: MeGUI, StaxRip or RealAnime.
My custom video profiles are linked in the first post of this thread and are made for MeGUI (but IIRC StaxRip support them too).
MeGUI guide is sticked at the top of this board, while StaxRip has it's own Help. RealAnime is so simple it shouldnt require a guide to use it.

[NeD tHe OnE]

MeGUI .. I have this .. now i didnt get ur profiles .. I mean i cant download it from the first post Dont know Y? Do u have any other link?

[buzzqw]

Sharktooth profiles also already included in MkvMagic

BHH

[NeD tHe OnE]

where can i get the profiles?

[NeD tHe OnE]

Profiles for maximizing Quality and hit a desired bitrate/filesize (2 or more passes, SLOW encoding, High Profile)HQ-Slow: Pretty slow but not much. Quality is near the best.HQ-Slower: Slower than HQ-Slow but it tries to squeeze some more compression thru the use of more reference frames.HQ-Slowest: Same as HQ-Slower with more reference frames.HQ-Insane: All settings maxed out

where will i get this presets?

[foxyshadis]

You can either update mkvmagic, or get sharktooth's builds of x264 and megui (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=89979). The site's down now, wait a few hours to try again.

[NeD tHe OnE]

God Plz Help!

[NeD tHe OnE]

eqm_avc_hr.cfg

jvt.cfg

mp4_guy's_AVC_Low_Bitrate_matrix.cfg

mp4_guy's_AVC_Low_Bitrate_matrix_V2.cfg

q_matrix.cfg

q_matrix2.cfg

soulhunter_v1.cfg

soulhunter_v2.cfg

What are these ? I mean when shd v use this? I mean the presets like fast, 1,2,3 CD's Slow encodin, anime etc

[nurbs]

You can find descriptions of the different matrices here (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=96159).

[NeD tHe OnE]

Ok, since more and more ppl is asking me how to set the x264/MeGUI options, here's the solution: Profiles.

Instructions
Install MeGUI (http://megui.sf.net/) and put x264.exe in the install directory.
Get the profiles archive (below) and use the MeGUI Import Profiles option to import them.
Once imported you will find the profiles in the "Video Profiles" drop down list.[/color] Before starting encoding set the bitrate or quantizer (manually or thru the calculator) and adjust the inloop filter accordingly to your needs/taste: keep it 1;1 or higher for anime/toons (max 3;3) and not higher than x264 defaults (0;0) for movies.[/i]

Profiles for maximizing Quality and hit a desired bitrate/filesize (2 or more passes, SLOW encoding, High Profile)
HQ-Slow: Pretty slow but not much. Quality is near the best.
HQ-Slower: Slower than HQ-Slow but it tries to squeeze some more compression thru the use of more reference frames.
HQ-Slowest: Same as HQ-Slower with more reference frames.
HQ-Insane: All settings maxed out.

Profiles for Common Encoding (2-passes)
CE-Highprofile: Common settings using high profile options (not compatible with QuickTime)
CE-Mainprofile: Common settings using main profile options (not compatible with QuickTime)
CE-QuickTime: Common settings for QuickTime 7 compatibility.
CE-Baseline: Common settings using baseline profile options (100% compatible with QuickTime 7)

Profiles for maximizing Speed and hit a desired bitrate/filesize (1-pass)
1P-Maxspeed: Everything disabled for max encoding speed (good for live capturing).
1P-Intermediate: Intermediate settings for average speed and final quality.
1P-Goodquality: Settings for good quality with 1 pass.

Profiles for constant Quality/Quantizer (1-pass)
CQ-Lossless: Lossless encoding.
CQ-ASP_Q2_equiv: Almost the equivalent of MPEG-4 ASP Q2 encoding.
CQ-ASP_Q2_eq(crf): Same as above but with "constant quality" (constant rate factor).

Profiles for Anime/Toons (2 passes)
AE-Standard: 2 passes, Main Profile, standard quality.
AE-Goodquality: Slower than AE-Standard, High Profile, higher quality.
AE-Maxquality: Slowest mode with maxed out settings, best quality.

Profiles for Consoles and Portable Devices
PD-PSP: Profile for Sony PSP playback.
PD-Xbox_Hires: Profile for MS XBOX and higher than 512pixels resolution (latest XBMC is needed).
PD-Xbox_LoRes: Profile for MS XBOX and lower than 512pixels resolutions (latest XBMC is needed).
PD-iPod: Profile for iPod Video based on Arstechnica settings (http://arstechnica.com/guides/tweaks/ipod-video.ars/6).

Download link: MeGUI-x264 Custom Video Profiles V24. (http://files.x264.nl/Sharktooth/force.php?file=./megui/profiles/MeGUI-x264_generic_profiles_v24.zip)

For questions, comments and requests ask in this thread.
Thanks goes to Sirber for suggestions for Anime profiles.


HQ-Slow[/b][/color]: Pretty slow but not much. Quality is near the best.
HQ-Slower: Slower than HQ-Slow but it tries to squeeze some more compression thru the use of more reference frames.
HQ-Slowest: Same as HQ-Slower with more reference frames.
HQ-Insane: All settings maxed out.

I need settings and custom profiles for these PROFILES... Hey Sharktooth! Plz Help me.. Even the download link isnt working

[Sharktooth]

http://www.webalice.it/f.corriga/megui/MeGUI-x264_generic_profiles_v24.zip

[NeD tHe OnE]

Thank You very much! Hey all those are xml files . How do u load them in the encoder? and how is your eqm_avc_hr.cfg

[NeD tHe OnE]

Can you plz give me a guide to use your video profiles

Thankyou

[Sharktooth]

Those are Profiles for MeGUI and other GUIs. They cant be loaded in x264 directly.
There's also a whole thread for my custom matrix and other threads with comparisons between matrices :search:

[NeD tHe OnE]

How do u use profiles then? I searched ... but I didnt get the results for encodin videos for different bitrates ..

Which of ur profile and matrix is good for 3 CD's rip and 2cd's rip and single cd... PLZ! I wont BUG u again!

[foxyshadis]

Load one into MeGUI, and copy its commandline (from the encoder config, or the logs). Or, y'know, just use megui if you're not trying to create batch files for stuff.

As sharktooth said, look to the matrix thread for help with matrices.

[NeD tHe OnE]

Hey Sharktooth! I m havin problem with ur profiles.. I get this Error... For eg .. if i choose HQ - Insane .. and even if i choose any other..

"Generating jobs. Desired size: 254803968 bytes
No audio encoding. Calculating desired video bitrate directly.
Setting video bitrate for the video jobs to 698 kbit/s
Setting desired size of video to 253418496 bytes
Starting job job1-1 at 11:58:21 AM
Job is a video job. encoder commandline:
--pass 1 --bitrate 698 --stats "G:\Vidz\new\English V songs\Enigma\EniGMa - CD TRck ALLSOnGS x264.VoRbis.MatRoska.NeDtHeOnE.stats" --bframes 3 --b-pyramid --filter -2,-1 --subme 1 --analyse none --direct auto --me dia --progress --no-psnr --output NUL "G:\Vidz\new\English V songs\Enigma\EniGMa - CD TRck ALLSOnGS x264.VoRbis.MatRoska.NeDtHeOnE.avs"
successfully started encoding
Processing ended at 11:58:22 AM
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Log for job job1-1

bad argument: --direct auto

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
job job1-1 has been processed. This job is linked to the next job: job1-2
Starting job job1-2 at 11:58:22 AM
Job is a video job. encoder commandline:
--pass 2 --bitrate 698 --stats "G:\Vidz\new\English V songs\Enigma\EniGMa - CD TRck ALLSOnGS x264.VoRbis.MatRoska.NeDtHeOnE.stats" --ref 16 --mixed-refs --no-fast-pskip --bframes 3 --b-pyramid --b-rdo --bime --weightb --filter -2,-1 --subme 7 --trellis 2 --analyse all --8x8dct --direct auto --me umh --progress --no-psnr --output "G:\Vidz\new\English V songs\Enigma\EniGMa - CD TRck ALLSOnGS x264.VoRbis.MatRoska.NeDtHeOnE.mkv" "G:\Vidz\new\English V songs\Enigma\EniGMa - CD TRck ALLSOnGS x264.VoRbis.MatRoska.NeDtHeOnE.avs"
successfully started encoding
Processing ended at 11:58:22 AM
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Log for job job1-2

unknown option ("

Encoding doesnt start @ all.. But if I Use the default video profile.... Encoding works...

Does snyone know why this is happenin?

[foxyshadis]

God, how old is your x264? Direct auto has been in svn for months. Didn't you update from sharktooth's build sticky?

[NeD tHe OnE]

hey foxy shadis wre will i get d latest x264 .... ?

[NeD tHe OnE]

mine is r364A sharktooth build and megui 0.2.3.2116

plz give me the links 4 d latest 1s

[nurbs]

Have you ever tried to :readfaq: (or rather sticky (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=106189)) or to :search:?
Also you should probably :readrule: while you're at it.

[NeD tHe OnE]

thx i got r517 and i hope that problem will be solved

[Sharktooth]

I added the first EXPERIMENTAL profile for HD-DVD compatibility.
Please advice me if there are wrong settings, it does not work or if it's just too slow...
The new profiles require MeGUI ver 0.2.3.2134.

[wolfmac]

The new profiles require MeGUI ver 0.2.3.2134

[The last version of MeGUI i can find ist 0.2.3.2132!
http://www.chronocrossdev.com/apps/megui/

Where can i get 0.2.3.2134?

Thanks
Wolfmac]

okay here:
http://www.webalice.it/f.corriga/megui/MeGUI-0.2.3.2134.7z

[berrinam]

Beyond 0.2.3.2132, the builds are still unstable development builds. A user build should be coming soon.

[Deinorius]

@Sharktooth
Why do you use for AE_Standard M.E. Algorithm: multihex?
Wouldn't it be better tu use hexagonal and -subme 6? With my tests it brings better compressibility and it's much faster.

[Sharktooth]

hexagonal is faster but inferior to multihex expecially on anime (in terms of quality).
however i doubt that swithching from subme 5 to 6 and from multihex to hex it will be faster.

[Deinorius]

I did some tests about this.

Athlon XP-M 2000+, 512 MB DDR333
x264 R512; --crf 24; everything else AE_Standard

30 min Fansub; no additional filter:

Parameter Speed (%) Size (%)
hex/subme5 100 100
mhex/subme5 77 97,9
hex/subme6/rdo 92,8 95,96

DVD-Rip - 1. Crop/BicubicResize(704,384)/RemoveGrain(1), 2. only Crop, 704,560: subme6/rdo means rdo for b-frames activated.
(1 min 31 s; short Anime clip with no action)

Parameter fps kbit/s
hex/subme5 8,32 404,68
mhex/subme5 7,48 399,38
hex/subme6 7,73 398,53
hex/subme6/rdo 7,44 392,97

hex/subme5 6,04 597,80
mhex/subme5 5,48 590,63
hex/subme6 5,62 587,81
hex/subme6/rdo 5,46 578,48

So converting from a Fansub it's much faster, nearly 16 %, and it compress better.
With DVD-Rips it has nearly the same speed with activated rdo for b-frames, but it compress about 2 % better everytime.

[Sharktooth]

ok, next version will take that into consideration.
thanks:)

[berrinam]

x264 R512; --crf 24; everything else AE_Standardakupenguin has said many times that a crf value only gives a constant quality for a given group of settings, which means that you can't compare the efficiency of settings by the filesize when doing crf compression. What you need to do is a constant filesize encode (eg 2pass ABR, target bitrate) and compare PSNR (or some other quality metric).

Otherwise, you are comparing the filesize of two files which were encoded to different quality levels at different speeds -- there is no control.

[Deinorius]

I could do that. It would be better, but to measure better compression this way should do it.

I think, I can use for the same source the same .stats file, because settings in 1.pass are identical, right?
It would speed up tests extremely.

I will get some tests on an Opteron 144@2250 too. So we will see, how speed differs from the settings. But he will use newest Sharktooth's profile.

[aguy]

Hey Sharktooth,

Just wondering where you found the specs for the HD-DVD profile. I have been able to find the blu ray specs but not the hd-dvd specs in my searching.

Thanks

[Sharktooth]

Here and there this forum.
Im not even sure it is completely compliant, that's why i asked for testers.

@Deinorius: i thought you were using constant quant... crf is not good for that comparison.

[berrinam]

You can use the same first pass stats file if the settings you use for first pass are the same. Since you are testing turbo, that's probably the case.

I'm not sure how constant quant fits into all of this, but I still imagine that 2pass is the best scenario to test the efficiency of settings, because it ensures that filesizes are the same, so a visual judgement is the be-all-end-all.

[Sharktooth]

then you'll need PSNR or SSIM or whatever to distinguish one encode from the other...

[lazyn00b]

I added the first EXPERIMENTAL profile for HD-DVD compatibility.
Please advice me if there are wrong settings, it does not work or if it's just too slow...
The new profiles require MeGUI ver 0.2.3.2134.

Ben Waggoner (Microsoft) over at AVS Forum says 250 frames is too long for GOP length, but he can't tell me the exact limit because of NDA. FWIW, Apple's DVD Studio Pro docs show the GOP for HD DVD can be set from 0.5 second to 5 seconds, which would be 12 to 120 frames for film content. I am still trying to find out exact specs, so I will post back when I find them.

Mainconcept's HD DVD preset shows 2 B-frames, so maybe it is best to use 2 instead of 3 to be on the safe side.

[berrinam]

then you'll need PSNR or SSIM or whatever to distinguish one encode from the other...Well, if you do it by CQ, then you are using a Quant metric instead. Who knows how good that is? But with 2pass, you can resort to trusting your eyes, whereas you can't with anything else (because the filesizes aren't the same, so visual comparisons are useless).

[mrkazador]

Question.....
Would HQ-Insane be good for an hd source?
Encoding time is not important to me.....

[foxyshadis]

All of the HQ profiles are good and slow, Insane extremely so. "HD" isn't nearly enough of a reference, so just try a few profiles and see what you think.

[Sharktooth]

v26: updated SA-HD-DVD profile.

[smok3]

Sharktooth; it would be actually great if you could provide the profiles as x264 command lines as well as xml.

[Sharktooth]

ill see what i can do

[buzzqw]

@smok3

quick way: open megui, load a profile , check show command line.

BHH

[Golgot13]

I have HD DVD player buy in USA. When I put H264 video from x264, I have warning messages
about maximum bitrate (--vbv maxrate at 12000kps and --vbv bufsize use ) in HD DVD authoring
software (professional).
There is some pic over the maximum bitrate of HD DVD specification.

And when I play in HD DVD player (DVDR with HD DVD image), the video block when there is pics
of maximum bitrate.

The Sonic Scenarist tutorial say the GOP must be less than 0.606 second,
so 18 frame in NTSC framerate (29.97) and 15 frame in PAL framerate (25).
for AVC (H264 video) and VC1.
The number of B frame is 2 no more.
No information about MBAFF and PAFF use (I don't recommend it because
there is not lot of hardware chipset that support it).

I need to know how I can encode in CBR with MeGui (-ratetol at 0 don't work -> change at 0.1)
to test video in HD DVD player.

And we don't need to put maxbirate at 25Mbit/s because at 10Mbit/s and ABR at 8Mbit/s
the picture is beautiful (LCD Samsung 42" HD Ready).




Golgot13

[berrinam]

Sharktooth; it would be actually great if you could provide the profiles as x264 command lines as well as xml.

ill see what i can doI actually think this might be worth integrating into MeGUI, to extend the 'export profiles' function -- it could export them in a plain text or .bat format (couldn't be too hard).

[CruNcher]

Golgot13 could you please try this encode with Scenarist 4

http://rapidshare.de/files/19907080/Silent_Hill-Trailer-High_Profile-5.1-LC-AAC-8000kbps.part1.rar.html
http://rapidshare.de/files/19907412/Silent_Hill-Trailer-High_Profile-5.1-LC-AAC-8000kbps.part2.rar.html

thx in advance

[Golgot13]

The big problem with x264 encoder is " NAL_HRD_PARAMETER ".
In this header, somes professionnal software read information about H264 video file.
The most import information is the bitrate (there is a minimum and a maximum
to be compliant with HD DVD and BluRay compliant).

The last version of Scenarist 4 don't accept file without this header.
I must to use a older version to mux the video data. And demux (with transport stream software)
the EVO file to have good file (with the most important header: NAL, VUI,...)

I recommend to encode in CBR mode but I don't know how I can do this with MeGui
(no option in MeGui to encode in CBR ???)


Golgot13

[Golgot13]

Golgot13 could you please try this encode with Scenarist 4

http://rapidshare.de/files/19907080/Silent_Hill-Trailer-High_Profile-5.1-LC-AAC-8000kbps.part1.rar.html
http://rapidshare.de/files/19907412/Silent_Hill-Trailer-High_Profile-5.1-LC-AAC-8000kbps.part2.rar.html

thx in advance


Scenarist 4 accept mp4 container but with only video stream H264 (compliant with
HD DVD and BluRay specification, with all headers....)
AAC audio track is not compliant HD DVD/BluRay.



Golgot13

[Chainmax]

On the iPod profile, the "I4x4" and "P4x4" macroblock options are not greyed out but they aren't enabled either. If I enable them, will the encode still be playable on an iPod?

[Sharktooth]

On the iPod profile, the "I4x4" and "P4x4" macroblock options are not greyed out but they aren't enabled either. If I enable them, will the encode still be playable on an iPod?
no...

[Chainmax]

Then shouldn't they be greyed out as well?

[Sharktooth]

no... ipod profile is just a MeGUI preset.. not a h.264 profile.
in megui x264 conf. window the only features that are grayed out ar the ones locked by h.264 levels and profiles.

[Chainmax]

I see, thanks for the info. About the SA-HD-DVD profile, what would the resolution limits be? Also, should a 640x480 encode made with that preset be playable on a standalone?

[Sharktooth]

Resolution limits are imposed by the HD-DVD specs, you should search the forum or ask to someone who exactly know the specs.

[Sharktooth]

V27:
- Faster CQ profiles
- Modified HD-DVD profile

[Chainmax]

Resolution limits are imposed by the HD-DVD specs, you should search the forum or ask to someone who exactly know the specs.

The hardware players forum still doesn't have a spec list, which is why I was basically asking you where you got them from.

[W3ird_N3rd]

I tried but I can't figure it out. I installed the profiles, and I keep getting an error telling me the value for SelectedIndex is not valid when I select a profile. Tried searching this thread, Google, no result..

Doesn't happen to all profiles, only to the profiles I would like to use :D. The HQ at least.

[Sharktooth]

Update MeGUI...:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=824894#post824894

[W3ird_N3rd]

I already installed the latest version from x264.nl (the full package), didn't help. I also have the latest profiles.

[edit]
Ah, so the latest full package does not include the latest MeGUI..

[Beave]

Just to make certain: Is the SA-HD-DVD profile now the closest to encoding 1080i material to 720p or 1080p?

In another thread I learned that using HQ settings is actually overkill for HD resolutions. What I'm trying to say is: Is this profile only trying to get as close as possible to the possible future HD-DVD standard or does it actually make sense to use this profile for the personal TS HDTV streams to 720p conversions?

My goal is to find a pretty balanced setting concidering encoding speed, quality and decoding speed for 720p and 1080p targets.

[Sharktooth]

The profile is experimental and was made from the info i had gathered around.
I think it "should" be compatible with HD-DVD standard (provided you use the correct resolution and FPS) but since i dont have the specs i cant be 100% sure.
If anyone has a HD-DVD player (toshiba) or a software that can test the streams for compatibility we can test if it works.

[shon3i]

@Sharktooth can you make some presets with AQ patch, similar AQ like ateme aq if this possible.

[Sharktooth]

ateme AQ is completely different from x264 AQ.
Also, AQ settings depends too much on the source to be included into a profile.

[shon3i]

ateme AQ is completely different from x264 AQ.
Also, AQ settings depends too much on the source to be included into a profile.
Thanks for info, too bad, because i tryed it with some very dark movie (--aq-strength 0.8 and --aq-sensitivity 1) x264 AQ makes big improvments in quality and PSNR with 700kbps, but little blur picture but is not noticable.

Can you do some profiles aimed for 1CD rips where be might need using some CQM to incrase quality in bitrate range of 600-900kbps like AutoGK settings.

PS. Nice new avatar!

[Sharktooth]

Usually the best quantization for that bitrates is the standard one...
However it's possible to create softer matrices that will help reduce blocking (but will kill details). At that point i prefer rising deblocking filter settings instead, even if a quant matrix maybe "could" produce better results.

P.S. Thanks:)

[desta]

Thanks for info, too bad, because i tryed it with some very dark movie (--aq-strength 0.8 and --aq-sensitivity 1) x264 AQ makes big improvments in quality and PSNR with 700kbps, but little blur picture but is not noticable.
I'm no expert, but I would've thought setting the sensitivity to 1 would drastically increase blocks and other artifacts?

I used "--aq-strength 0.8 and --aq-sensitivity 5" on a test encode that had a bitrate of around 1700kbps, and the output was full of blocks. When I raised the sensitivity above 10, they went.

[Sharktooth]

what does that have to do with my custom MeGUI profiles?

[desta]

I apologise for commenting about another comment that also had nothing to do with your custom MeGUI profiles...

[haubrija]

The profile is experimental and was made from the info i had gathered around.
I think it "should" be compatible with HD-DVD standard (provided you use the correct resolution and FPS) but since i dont have the specs i cant be 100% sure.
If anyone has a HD-DVD player (toshiba) or a software that can test the streams for compatibility we can test if it works.

I thought there was no existing authoring software that could handle AVC or VC-1 streams for HD-DVD.

[Chainmax]

If I recall correctly, Nero can already author HD-DVDs. I don't know what codecs does it accepts as input though.

[Ghim]

I have two small suggestions for the PD-PSP profile:

- The PSP 2.80 firmware has added quite a few things in H264 support. The PSP can now read standard MPEG-4 containers (no more need for Atomchanger !!!), accept any framerate...
However, Sony also introduced a new check on the H.264 level set during the encoding and all files encoded in Main Profile with a level > 2.1 will be rejected. It would be nice to change the default level in the PD-PSP profile to 2.1.

-Starting with firmware 2.60, the seeking is more accurate. However, the PSP will freeze for some reason during the seeking if the file has been encoded with the PD-PSP profile. This is due to the 3 B-Frames and the 2 Reference Frames settings. Putting 1 B-Frame and 1 Reference Frame solves this issue. (see this post for more information: http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=755401#post755401)

[Doom9]

he PSP 2.80 firmware has added quite a few things in H264 support. The PSP can now read standard MPEG-4 containers (no more need for Atomchanger !!!), accept any framerate...Have they finally seen the light? I also noted that the filename limitation is no longer in effect.. so finally a halfway usable firmware.. the downside is that with all the new versions you can't run homebrewn software so perhaps it would make sense to have multiple profiles for different firmware revisions.

[Sharktooth]

v28: Updated PSP profile with Level 2.1.

Question: what's the iPod highest supported level?

[elguaxo]

Now HQ-Slow, Slower, Slowest, Insane have VBV Maximum Bitrate: 25000
Max local bitrate, what is that?

[leiming2006]

About the title:
The date is wrong.
It's July, not September.

[Sharktooth]

Now HQ-Slow, Slower, Slowest, Insane have VBV Maximum Bitrate: 25000
Max local bitrate, what is that?
it's the new default for all bitrate based profiles. it sets the maximum bitrate cap.

About the title:
The date is wrong.
It's July, not September.
my head was already on september... :D

[Sharktooth]

v29:
Updated iPod profile (Lvl 1.3 and max bitrate 768kbps)
Some already "not-too-slow" profiles got a speed boost

[Sharktooth]

definatly not the right place.

[Taxidermista]

Couple of questions about HD-DVD profile:

- Sonic Scenarist tech specs mention AVC (H.264) Main/High Profiles, Levels 3, 3.1, 3.2, 4, and 4.1 for h.264 assets. Should it be advisable to restrict level to 4.1 in HD-DVD profile?

- There's a few tips in Apple DVD Studio Pro 4.1 docs about h.264 assets. I don't know exactly if they are useful for the HD-DVD profile:

SD resolutions - Bitrate limits: from 0.5 Mbps to 15 Mbps
HD resolutions - Bitrate limits: from 1.5 Mbps to 29.4 Mbps
Key frame interval limits: from 0.5 sec to 5 sec (0.5 sec increments)


I'm gonna try to import some x264 video assets in Studio Pro and see what happens.

[Sharktooth]

Ehr... it was already restricted to 4.1 but it seems it got somewhat mistakenly removed.
I'll fix it ASAP.
Regarding the bitrate, x264 rate control can be set to respect the maximum bitrate cap, but not the minimum.

EDIT:

V30: Restored the Level 4.1 limit in HD-DVD profile. The profile is made for HD content and may return sub-optimal results for SD.

[Sharktooth]

V31: Updated VBV parameters, quantization and GOP parameters in HD-DVD profile. This profile should be compatible with 25FPS encodings.

[Chainmax]

Are the HD-DVD profile settings still guesses or did you find some official info?

[Sharktooth]

Still guesses.

[Chainmax]

I don't understand why is it taking so long for those specs to be released. After all, HD-DVD/BluRay/AVCHD standalones are being developed right now which means specs are final, right?

[Lemonadez]

---------------------------
AviSynth error
---------------------------
AviSynth script error:

Script error: there is no function named "DirectShowSource"
---------------------------
OK
---------------------------

[Adub]

I am sure that the specs must be somewhere. I will do some research this weekend and report back if I find anything.

@Lemonadez
What versions are you using of a) AviSynth and b) the Megui Profiles?
Also, make sure you have the plugin in your plugin folder, just incase you deleted it by accident or something.

[Sharktooth]

there are specs but not available for free

[Chainmax]

That sucks :(.

I recently started a thread in the AVC subforum asking what did "No DCT Decimation" do and it seems to be somewhat similar to Fast P-Skip and was advisable to enable when using Trellis. Could the highest quality profiles be modified to reflect that?

[Sharktooth]

Ok, ill add it to HQ-Insane, HQ-Slowest and AE-Maxquality

[check]

I've heard it's bad for animated content (#x264 on IRC). Some testing seems to be in order :)

[Hobojobo]

Hi,
what is the difference between these two profiles: cq-asp_q2_aquiv and cq-asp_asp_q2_eq(crf) ?

I guess it is the "constant rate factor". I'm good. ;)

What exactly does that mean?

I like one pass encoding and the idea of constant quality.

[check]

crf attempts to provide a more perceptually constant quality, whereas cq provides a constant quantizer, which is somewhat less perceptually constant but mathematically constant. crf is probably what you are looking to use - the filesize will be lower and visual quality (theoretically) identical.

[Sharktooth]

I've heard it's bad for animated content (#x264 on IRC). Some testing seems to be in order :)
any news?

[iMaGe]

Sharktooth, is there a reason why you've limited the HighRes XBOX profile's Minimum Quantizer to 18? I've been experimenting with a minimum of 10 with 1.5Mbps bitrate which plays perfectly on my regular softmodded xbox.

[Sharktooth]

Yes, coz sometimes (depending on the source) Q18 gives too-high bitrates resulting in dropped frames during playback.
However Q18 has excellent quality (similar to xvid Q2) and there's really no need to risk your encode wont play back correctly coz of the lower quantizer.

[migrena]

apple added this to video specs for ipods:
"H.264 video, up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480 pixels, 30 frames per sec., Baseline Low-Complexity Profile"
but i have no idea what low-complexity means

[Sharktooth]

They rised the max bitrate from 768 to 1.5mbps...
low complexity maybe is the apple "re-definition" of Level 1.3...

[Taxidermista]

They rised the max bitrate from 768 to 1.5mbps...
low complexity maybe is the apple "re-definition" of Level 1.3...

I don't think so. There are 2 different h.264 profiles and one mpeg4 sp profile:

H.264 video, up to 1.5 Mbps, 640 by 480 pixels, 30 frames per sec., Baseline Low-Complexity Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps, 48 kHz, stereo audio in .m4v, .mp4, and .mov file formats

H.264 video, up to 768 Kbps, 320 by 240 pixels, 30 frames per sec., Baseline Profile up to Level 1.3 with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps, 48 kHz, stereo audio in .m4v, .mp4, and .mov file formats

MPEG-4 video, up to 2.5 Mbps, 640 by 480 pixels, 30 frames per sec., Simple Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps, 48 kHz, stereo audio in .m4v, .mp4, and .mov file formats

Maybe baseline LC profile is a new avc profile defined by Apple. :)

[Sharktooth]

well, dunno but i think it has something to do with their Level 1.3 and 1.5Mbps... or with Baseline+Bframes thing...

[migrena]

old profile with 640x480 clip wont work on ipod (tested)
is there a possibility that this may be an issue with container not codec settings? this video (http://www.eugbanana.com/EverythingApple/Movies/Cornell-640-7.1.3.mov) in mov container works but when remuxed to mp4 it wont play anymore

[check]

have you tried muxing to mp4 with a hint track?

[Sharktooth]

V32:
HQ-Insane is even more "insane"... (removed fast first pass, added no-dct-decimation)
Added iPod 5.5G profile.

[migrena]

have you tried muxing to mp4 with a hint track?
if you are talking about timecodes then no, i did this with yamb and there is no such option in yamb
i could remux mov to mkv and extract timecodes then but i still dont know how to mux them to mp4

ps that new profile doesnt work on 5g with 1.2 software, no idea why...

[anonymez]

and there is no such option in yamb

options-->general-->enable import settings :)

[Sharktooth]

if you are talking about timecodes then no, i did this with yamb and there is no such option in yamb
i could remux mov to mkv and extract timecodes then but i still dont know how to mux them to mp4

ps that new profile doesnt work on 5g with 1.2 software, no idea why...
EDIT: Uhm, i have no iPod to test it...

[migrena]

this profile is perfectly fine, it should work if apple specs were complete...
is it possible that only movies encoded with apple avc codec will play on ipod? i dont like the idea of either buying movies from itunes store or buying quicktime to export movies to ipod format

[Taxidermista]

Added iPod 5.5G profile.

I did a little test on my iPod 5G with firmware 1.2. I've encoded the World Trade Center HD trailer (from Apple) to a mp4 file with the new iPod 5.5G profile.

iTunes rejects this clip (that stupid tag thing (http://lists.mplayerhq.hu/pipermail/ffmpeg-devel/2006-September/045391.html)) but you can place it on the iPod with the richardsj dummie trick (http://www.ipodwizard.net/showthread.php?t=15015).

Trailer specs:

Resolution: 640x380
fps: 23.976
Video: x264 baseline profile level 3 (Sharktooth's iPod 5.5G profile)
Video bitrate: 1200 Kbps
Audio: AAC LC stereo
Audio bitrate: 128 Kbps
Length: 2:29.05
Size: 24 MB

If someone wanna try it can be downloaded from here (http://www.2shared.com/file/1624703/32225486/worldtradecentertrailerx264ipod.html).

The video plays fine on my iPod, the quality is ok but it looks better in Windows (Media Player Classic + CoreAVC). The video pixelates in some places, specially in scene transitions.

Maybe a mpeg4 sp vs h.264 @1.5Mbps challenge is in order. :)

[Sharktooth]

V33:
Updated HQ-Slowest with no-dct-decimate and PD-iPod 5.5G profile: disabled deblocking and all macroblock paritions (it will reduce quality but will save batteries...).

[Taxidermista]

V33:
Updated HQ-Slowest with no-dct-decimate and PD-iPod 5.5G profile (disabled deblocking and all macroblock paritions).

Ups, bad timing! :D

The WTC trailer is encoded with your "old" 5.5G profile.

[Sharktooth]

Well, the new profile will have a bit less quality but will save batteries for longer movies ;)

[Adub]

Should we maybe have 2 profiles then? One for battery and one for quality? I just know that some people care more about quality than battery life. Just a thought.

[Sharktooth]

I'll add it in the next version.

[Adub]

great! Thanks Sharktooth.

[CubaMAN]

I tried your Quicktime Profile but unfortunately playing with current Quicktime Player shows only a white frame. Audio works.

[Sharktooth]

Can you be more precise on the encoding setup?

[simonhowson]

Should we maybe have 2 profiles then? One for battery and one for quality? I just know that some people care more about quality than battery life. Just a thought. Does the deblocking filter make a significant difference on battery life? Have there been any tests, or is this just an expectation? Will the difference be significant, i.e. will deblocking off double the battery life?

I have a new 80 GB iPod, and so I want do tests, but I'm still figuring out exactly how to encode something properly. :o

[check]

deblocking adds around 20% to CPU requirments, so I would expect disabling it to lead to a 20% boost in battery life - assuming bitrate was the same of course.

[CubaMAN]

Can you be more precise on the encoding setup?

I chose your CE-Quicktime MP4 Profile ....didn't change anything and audio aac lc variable bitrate Q=0,5. Filters: deinterlace, resize, noise filter (minimal) and mpeg2 deblock. I can upload an example file if you wish.

[Sharktooth]

Weird... i just did an encode and it works.
Just a question... How many FPS?

[CubaMAN]

Weird... i just did an encode and it works.
Just a question... How many FPS?

PAL 25fps. If I just encode video everythings fine, but audio and video produces a white frame playing only audio. Don't really know if the mp4muxer produces a corrupt file. Is the Quicktime Version on Mac different to the version on Windows?

[Sharktooth]

AFAIK no... however is your mp4box up to date?

[Synergy37]

I followed the info found in this thread:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=880122#post880122

and I still can't get this to work. When I add it to iTunes it plays fine and then it won't transfer to the iPod because it says a bad bit rate.

[Sharktooth]

what bitrate did you set?

[Synergy37]

1000, 1112, and 700

[check]

have you tried something lower, like <500?

[simonhowson]

1000, 1112, and 700 Is it possible that the average is set below 1500, but the maximum is going over 1500? So the -Vbv maxbitrate switch should be on?

I'm using the iPod 5.5 profile and nicmp4box to mux the video and audio together, and it is working fine. The profile targets 1000 Kbps as the average for the video, but features the --vbv maxbitrate 1500 setting so the bitrate doesn't go too high.

[Synergy37]

I think it was becuase I was fooling around with the profiles. I'm gonna redo my profiles so they are how Sharktooth sets them and then I'll reencode tonight. Hopefully this works.

[Synergy37]

Alright so I tried the Shark Tooth profile at 1000 kbps and it idn't work. Now I'm trying 768 kbps and if that doesn't work I'll wait for a program with a preset profile to encode. Any other ideas?

[check]

From what's going on in the ipod thread it sounds like the maximum is 768kbits - try setting the vbvmaxrate to 768 and the bitrate below that.

[simonhowson]

Alright so I tried the Shark Tooth profile at 1000 kbps and it idn't work. Now I'm trying 768 kbps and if that doesn't work I'll wait for a program with a preset profile to encode. Any other ideas? Is it possible that you are using a width other than 640? To use the 1500 Kbps bitrate I am pretty sure the resolution must be 640 wide, it can't be anything else.